027: The Acoustic Shadow

Episode Transcript

[0:00:02 – 0:00:03] Erik: All right, we are here.
[0:00:04 – 0:00:05] Erik: We’re doing it.
[0:00:06 – 0:00:06] Erik: As promised.
[0:00:07 – 0:00:07] Adam: For safety.
[0:00:08 – 0:00:10] Adam: And as promised, because we’re men of our word.
[0:00:11 – 0:00:11] Adam: We are.
[0:00:11 – 0:00:18] Adam: And we want to make sure our fellow muck booters are safe if they should end up in the water.
[0:00:20 – 0:00:28] Erik: So as we talked about in the past, there is maybe a concern for muck boot portagers while they are in the canoe.
[0:00:30 – 0:00:34] Erik: and how those react to a potential capsizing situation.
[0:00:35 – 0:00:35] Erik: I don’t know.
[0:00:35 – 0:00:37] Erik: Maybe this isn’t a concern, but we’re here now.
[0:00:37 – 0:00:39] Erik: We’re sitting on the edge of a dock, and we’re doing it.
[0:00:40 – 0:00:48] Erik: And we were talking right before we kind of got to this point, like, what do we do to, like, capsize a canoe?
[0:00:48 – 0:00:50] Adam: How do you capsize a canoe on purpose?
[0:00:51 – 0:00:51] Adam: You just lean?
[0:00:52 – 0:00:58] Adam: Both of us are going to lean to the right, it looks like here, real hard, and then until one of us jumps out and then sends the other one flying.
[0:00:59 – 0:01:00] Adam: Yeah.
[0:01:00 – 0:01:09] Adam: But, yeah, I was driving up here, and I’m like, honestly, I think when we capsized on caribou and the stringer of walleye almost got away, I’m pretty sure I was wearing muck boots then, and I didn’t sink and die.
[0:01:10 – 0:01:15] Adam: Like, we just went to shore, and I just had to pour my boots out, and really the main problem was the socks.
[0:01:15 – 0:01:19] Adam: I had to wring those socks out, but the boots themselves, I’m pretty sure if you threw one of these in the lake, it would float.
[0:01:20 – 0:01:20] Erik: Yeah.
[0:01:20 – 0:01:21] Adam: We should test that after maybe.
[0:01:21 – 0:01:23] Adam: Does the boot itself even sink or float?
[0:01:25 – 0:01:26] Adam: But I think we’re going to be fine.
[0:01:26 – 0:01:28] Adam: But we are both wearing life jackets for safety.
[0:01:28 – 0:01:28] Adam: Yes.
[0:01:29 – 0:01:31] Adam: And there’s zero lifeguards on duty.
[0:01:31 – 0:01:33] Erik: So we’re on our own here.
[0:01:33 – 0:01:40] Erik: So it is kind of funny that after we made the promise that we would do this, you maybe remembered actually…
[0:01:40 – 0:01:43] Adam: Yeah, like this might not be necessary, but it’s such a nice day.
[0:01:43 – 0:01:45] Adam: I just kind of want to capsize.
[0:01:45 – 0:01:46] Adam: Is that strange?
[0:01:47 – 0:01:49] Erik: I mean, at this point, yeah, I’m actually feeling kind of hot in the sun.
[0:01:49 – 0:01:50] Erik: I’m a little warm.
[0:01:50 – 0:01:57] Erik: And we are time-lapsing this, so we will hopefully be able to show our floundering efforts.
[0:01:57 – 0:02:03] Erik: We also thought about if we get out there and we’re feeling all right, maybe trying some re-entries.
[0:02:03 – 0:02:03] Adam: Yeah.
[0:02:04 – 0:02:05] Adam: To get back into the canoe?
[0:02:05 – 0:02:06] Adam: Yeah, with muck boots on.
[0:02:06 – 0:02:07] Erik: Yeah.
[0:02:07 – 0:02:07] Adam: Yeah.
[0:02:08 – 0:02:10] Erik: You know, it’s obviously no gear.
[0:02:10 – 0:02:13] Erik: This is a very controlled environment that we are working in here.
[0:02:13 – 0:02:17] Erik: So it’s semi close to real life.
[0:02:17 – 0:02:23] Erik: I mean, I’ve got the camping pants on and the muck boots with socks, but we are not obviously loaded with gear.
[0:02:24 – 0:02:24] Adam: Right.
[0:02:25 – 0:02:31] Adam: But yeah, I mean, this is as close to as I would dress in October, except for I would definitely be wearing long sleeves.
[0:02:31 – 0:02:32] Adam: I’m in a t-shirt.
[0:02:33 – 0:02:35] Adam: But I just want to kind of replicate it to the greatest ability.
[0:02:35 – 0:02:39] Adam: Like, how it would feel to be in water wearing this gear in fall, even though…
[0:02:39 – 0:02:40] Adam: I’m pretty sure it’s not going to be.
[0:02:40 – 0:02:41] Adam: We’re both strong swimmers.
[0:02:42 – 0:02:48] Adam: I’m not thinking it’s going to be an issue, but this is why we’re out here to test it out so you guys don’t have to.
[0:02:48 – 0:02:50] Adam: Basically, we’re taking one for the team here.
[0:02:51 – 0:02:52] Adam: We hope you enjoy it.
[0:02:52 – 0:02:57] Adam: I just hope I look okay and not like a total crazed mongoloid falling out of a canoe.
[0:02:57 – 0:03:01] Adam: I hope my capsizing game is really on point today.
[0:03:02 – 0:03:03] Adam: There’s no way to prepare for that.
[0:03:03 – 0:03:04] Adam: We’ve had no test runs.
[0:03:04 – 0:03:06] Adam: I don’t know how to look good when you’re capsizing.
[0:03:07 – 0:03:07] Erik: Right, exactly.
[0:03:07 – 0:03:12] Erik: I’m more concerned about the capsizing than being able to stay afloat once we’re in the water.
[0:03:12 – 0:03:13] Erik: How do we capsize?
[0:03:13 – 0:03:14] Erik: What do we do?
[0:03:14 – 0:03:20] Erik: But, yeah, so we’re going to set the microphone down, jump in the canoe, and kind of drift off into the depths.
[0:03:21 – 0:03:24] Erik: And if you don’t hear from us again, it’s been a good run.
[0:03:24 – 0:03:26] Erik: I mean, 26 episodes, that’s good.
[0:03:26 – 0:03:27] Erik: Pretty cool.
[0:03:27 – 0:03:27] Erik: That’s solid.
[0:03:27 – 0:03:29] Adam: It’s been a lot of fun.
[0:03:29 – 0:03:29] Erik: Yeah.
[0:03:30 – 0:03:31] Erik: So here we go.
[0:03:38 – 0:03:40] Erik: Not even trying.
[0:03:49 – 0:03:51] Erik: Bon voyage!
[0:03:51 – 0:03:52] Erik: Can’t believe we’re doing this.
[0:03:55 – 0:03:56] Erik: It’s for science.
[0:03:57 – 0:04:04] Erik: We’ll start describing our scenarios but having to talk extra loud to make up for the distance from the mic.
[0:04:04 – 0:04:06] Erik: People will actually think we’re struggling.
[0:04:10 – 0:04:12] Adam: Quite the gale out here.
[0:04:12 – 0:04:15] Adam: Oh, these four-foot rollers.
[0:04:15 – 0:04:17] Adam: We shouldn’t get sideways like this, Eric.
[0:04:17 – 0:04:18] Adam: Oh, no.
[0:04:18 – 0:04:22] Erik: I think we’re definitely in a position where we’re… We won’t touch.
[0:04:22 – 0:04:24] Erik: I don’t think we’re going to touch out here.
[0:04:25 – 0:04:25] Erik: Oh, boy.
[0:04:25 – 0:04:27] Erik: Do we want to set a countdown?
[0:04:27 – 0:04:27] Erik: Yeah.
[0:04:28 – 0:04:29] Erik: Are we going to the right?
[0:04:30 – 0:04:32] Erik: I think for the camera’s sake, we should go to the right.
[0:04:32 – 0:04:33] Erik: All right, we’re going to the right.
[0:04:33 – 0:04:35] Adam: I think I’m just going to roll.
[0:04:35 – 0:04:35] Adam: Okay.
[0:04:35 – 0:04:36] Erik: One, two, three.
[0:04:42 – 0:04:43] Adam: My feet are floating.
[0:04:43 – 0:04:44] Erik: Oh, wow.
[0:04:45 – 0:04:46] Adam: Wow, that’s unexpected.
[0:04:47 – 0:04:53] Erik: Yes, the muck hood’s definitely too floaty.
[0:04:53 – 0:04:57] Erik: I’m sort of filling with water, but I don’t think it’s going to matter.
[0:04:58 – 0:04:59] Adam: Oh, my paddle’s going to float.
[0:04:59 – 0:05:00] Adam: You want to try and flip this over?
[0:05:01 – 0:05:03] SPEAKER_00: Two hours later.
[0:05:03 – 0:05:08] Erik: Well, recording in waist-deep water, finishing up.
[0:05:09 – 0:05:10] Erik: First thoughts?
[0:05:11 – 0:05:35] Adam: well it’s not that hard to capsize you just kind of lean out and fall in and the boat just kind of follows yeah um yeah the my initial reaction was that the boat the the boots uh don’t fill with water immediately so like your feet float too much yeah i kind of was i’m glad i was wearing the life jacket because then i kind of just floated like a baby in the water and uh
[0:05:36 – 0:05:47] Adam: yeah until the key was to like honestly get the water in the boots so you could kind of like use your legs like normal again to try and like then we tried to write the ship we didn’t do a very good job of it but you know
[0:05:48 – 0:05:53] Erik: No, that was just a secondary goal is maybe we see if we can flip the boat back over and get in.
[0:05:53 – 0:05:55] Erik: Kind of unexpected.
[0:05:55 – 0:06:06] Erik: Almost the opposite of what we were claiming was the reason people were worried about them is that you actually, yeah, like your boots float and it’s really weird feeling and swimming is a challenge.
[0:06:06 – 0:06:09] Adam: Like if you didn’t have a life jacket on, would you just like flip upside down maybe?
[0:06:10 – 0:06:33] Erik: yeah that’s kind of what it would we were talking about the last episode is what it would feel like having styrofoam boots on but then yeah like i don’t know like this is relatively calm waters we’re in it’s warm we don’t have any gear and we kind of horsed around with it for a minute but could you imagine capsizing out in the middle of a lake in like actual waves with gear wow i mean it’d be very terrible nothing in cold water like you know
[0:06:33 – 0:06:49] Adam: yeah yeah it would be very hard to get it flip back over and get two people back in and kind of make your way to shore with a really loaded down canoe like you’re never gonna get all the water out even if you do a great job but even just a little bit of water in here like this it’s like barely upright i don’t think even we couldn’t get back in this right now
[0:06:50 – 0:06:52] Erik: I tried sitting in it for a minute and I basically just sank.
[0:06:53 – 0:06:54] Erik: I don’t know what’s…
[0:06:54 – 0:06:56] Adam: I was holding on to the front end.
[0:06:56 – 0:06:56] Adam: Yeah.
[0:06:56 – 0:06:58] Erik: And it’s, like I said, it’s calm out here.
[0:06:58 – 0:07:05] Erik: I don’t think most people are capsizing in dangerous situations where they’re going to have nice calm waters to work with.
[0:07:05 – 0:07:05] Erik: So…
[0:07:06 – 0:07:08] Adam: So bottom line is don’t capsize.
[0:07:08 – 0:07:11] Adam: If it’s really windy, don’t risk it.
[0:07:12 – 0:07:18] Erik: Always wear the life jacket, and if you do have muck boots on, they will not sink you to the bottom.
[0:07:18 – 0:07:21] Erik: They actually float right away, but you have to like jostle.
[0:07:21 – 0:07:24] Adam: You have to force water into them really is the key.
[0:07:25 – 0:07:26] Adam: We did learn something.
[0:07:26 – 0:07:26] Erik: I think we did.
[0:07:26 – 0:07:27] Erik: All right.
[0:07:27 – 0:07:28] Erik: All right.
[0:07:29 – 0:07:32] Erik: Well, with that, I think our experiment… Did you hear that?
[0:07:32 – 0:07:35] Adam: Yeah, I think I heard a loon in the distance.
[0:07:36 – 0:07:37] Adam: Our intro band is here.
[0:08:02 – 0:08:09] Adam: Welcome to episode 027 of Tumble Home, a Boundary Waters podcast.
[0:08:10 – 0:08:11] Adam: We’re out of the pool.
[0:08:12 – 0:08:13] Adam: Enough shenanigans.
[0:08:14 – 0:08:14] Adam: Yeah.
[0:08:14 – 0:08:17] Adam: We’re back here in Studio A.
[0:08:18 – 0:08:21] Adam: The primary, well, I don’t know about primary, but you know.
[0:08:22 – 0:08:23] Adam: Well, it’s Studio A.
[0:08:23 – 0:08:23] Adam: Studio A.
[0:08:24 – 0:08:25] Adam: So it sounds like it should be primary.
[0:08:26 – 0:08:27] Adam: It is the original studio.
[0:08:28 – 0:08:28] Adam: Yes.
[0:08:28 – 0:08:29] Adam: The sounds of nature.
[0:08:30 – 0:08:30] Adam: The sounds of wind.
[0:08:30 – 0:08:32] Adam: There’s hummingbirds and wind.
[0:08:33 – 0:08:33] Erik: There is a hummingbird.
[0:08:34 – 0:08:36] Erik: Definitely buzzing us.
[0:08:37 – 0:08:38] Erik: No worries there.
[0:08:38 – 0:08:46] Adam: But yes, we’ve extracted ourselves and the canoe from the pond and are safe and sound here, nice and dry.
[0:08:47 – 0:08:51] Adam: And we’re ready to bring you some new podcast.
[0:08:51 – 0:08:51] Adam: Are you excited?
[0:08:52 – 0:08:52] Adam: I’m excited.
[0:08:52 – 0:08:53] Adam: Yeah, I’m excited.
[0:08:53 – 0:08:53] Adam: I’m Adam.
[0:08:53 – 0:08:56] Adam: I’m here with Eric, as always.
[0:08:56 – 0:08:56] Adam: Yes.
[0:08:56 – 0:08:57] Adam: Eric, hello.
[0:08:57 – 0:09:02] Adam: Tumble Home is always, of course, brought to you by Clearwater Historic Lodge and Outfitters.
[0:09:03 – 0:09:04] Adam: Don’t forget the Outfitters.
[0:09:04 – 0:09:05] Erik: Yeah, we outfit.
[0:09:06 – 0:09:10] Adam: And also this week by… Stiegel.
[0:09:11 – 0:09:12] Adam: It’s a Radler.
[0:09:13 – 0:09:14] Adam: Great fruit.
[0:09:14 – 0:09:14] Erik: Ready?
[0:09:14 – 0:09:15] Adam: Yeah.
[0:09:17 – 0:09:18] Erik: It’s a stereo Radler.
[0:09:19 – 0:09:20] Erik: Stereo Radler.
[0:09:20 – 0:09:23] Erik: It’s perfect when you get done with a cap size.
[0:09:24 – 0:09:24] Erik: Yeah.
[0:09:25 – 0:09:26] Adam: You don’t want to warm up.
[0:09:26 – 0:09:27] Adam: You want to stay cool.
[0:09:27 – 0:09:33] Adam: Keep the goose bumps going with that Stiegel Grapefruit Rattler.
[0:09:33 – 0:09:34] Adam: Grapefruit Rattler?
[0:09:34 – 0:09:38] Adam: It’s a pint and an extra .9 fluid ounces on top.
[0:09:38 – 0:09:40] Erik: Yeah, we were looking at these cans.
[0:09:40 – 0:09:41] Erik: I’m like, these look large.
[0:09:41 – 0:09:42] Erik: They’re very tall cans.
[0:09:43 – 0:09:44] Adam: Yep, they are.
[0:09:44 – 0:09:45] Adam: They’re a little bit taller.
[0:09:46 – 0:09:48] Adam: And just a little bit wider than a Min Gold.
[0:09:49 – 0:09:49] Erik: Yep.
[0:09:49 – 0:09:50] Erik: Looks like.
[0:09:50 – 0:09:52] Erik: Should make a Stiegel commercial.
[0:09:53 – 0:09:54] Adam: Here at Stiegel.
[0:09:54 – 0:09:55] Adam: We give you more than a pint.
[0:09:56 – 0:09:57] Adam: A silo isn’t enough.
[0:09:58 – 0:09:58] Adam: Stiegel.
[0:09:58 – 0:10:00] Adam: It’s a tall man, not a tall boy.
[0:10:00 – 0:10:03] Erik: About the extra 0.9 fluid ounces.
[0:10:03 – 0:10:04] Erik: That makes the difference.
[0:10:04 – 0:10:04] Erik: Cheers.
[0:10:09 – 0:10:10] Erik: Tres Tastiamo.
[0:10:10 – 0:10:11] Erik: Thank you, Austria.
[0:10:12 – 0:10:15] Erik: Yeah, so you kept saying, you said pool, and then you said pond.
[0:10:16 – 0:10:17] Erik: We were, in fact, on Clearwater.
[0:10:18 – 0:10:19] Erik: Yeah, in the pool.
[0:10:19 – 0:10:21] Erik: In the back, so you had the pool side of Clearwater.
[0:10:22 – 0:10:24] Adam: We were kind of in the pool of Clearwater.
[0:10:24 – 0:10:39] Erik: Yeah, the only place that I, especially at this point now, knowing what I know, I mean, I assumed that capsizing a canoe was no fun, but now that we physically went through it, I’m glad we did it where we did.
[0:10:39 – 0:10:40] Adam: Yeah, it’s so fun we did it twice.
[0:10:41 – 0:10:41] Erik: We did, yes.
[0:10:41 – 0:10:44] Adam: We went back for another capsize.
[0:10:44 – 0:10:50] Adam: We had a pretty tame capsize to start, but we went back out for a more extreme capsize.
[0:10:50 – 0:10:54] Erik: Yeah, we went out the second time and I gunnel pumped with you in the front of the canoe.
[0:10:54 – 0:10:56] Adam: Waving like I’m in a parade.
[0:10:57 – 0:11:02] Adam: We do have a video capture, a time-lapse video capture of this.
[0:11:02 – 0:11:05] Adam: We’ll be sharing on the social media page.
[0:11:05 – 0:11:06] Adam: Stick around for that.
[0:11:06 – 0:11:06] Adam: It’s a lot of fun.
[0:11:07 – 0:11:08] Erik: We’ll set that to some yakety sacks.
[0:11:11 – 0:11:20] Adam: Yeah, my main comment that I didn’t get on the field audio was that I was expecting it to be colder than it was.
[0:11:20 – 0:11:25] Adam: I’ve swam in clear water many times, but even in July, I mean, it’s not that hot of a day.
[0:11:25 – 0:11:31] Adam: So I was expecting it to be like more of a shock when you usually capsize or fall in or whatever.
[0:11:31 – 0:11:32] Adam: Usually it’s a…
[0:11:33 – 0:11:34] Adam: You can barely breathe.
[0:11:34 – 0:11:34] Adam: Yeah.
[0:11:34 – 0:11:35] Adam: The water is just bad.
[0:11:35 – 0:11:36] Adam: That’s why I’m calling it the pool.
[0:11:37 – 0:11:37] Adam: It was very nice.
[0:11:37 – 0:11:39] Adam: It’s a bathtub warm out there right now.
[0:11:40 – 0:11:44] Adam: Beautiful swimming conditions, which is why we went back for a second capsize.
[0:11:44 – 0:11:45] Adam: Why not try it again?
[0:11:45 – 0:11:45] Erik: Yeah.
[0:11:46 – 0:11:48] Adam: But yeah, what did we learn?
[0:11:49 – 0:11:49] Adam: Well.
[0:11:50 – 0:11:57] Adam: It’s really hard to try and get a canoe flip back over when you’re in the water where you cannot touch the bottom.
[0:11:58 – 0:12:19] Adam: exactly we were like let’s try it i want to really i’ve always heard you can do this never actually have been in a position where i had to try but today is the perfect day for it let’s actually see if i can flip this canoe over by myself and then get back into it and even in beautiful warm water conditions where it wasn’t really anything on the line
[0:12:20 – 0:12:20] Adam: Pretty much impossible.
[0:12:21 – 0:12:23] Adam: I mean, I’m sure there’s techniques.
[0:12:23 – 0:12:25] Adam: Maybe we need to study up a little bit.
[0:12:25 – 0:12:31] Erik: Yeah, I mean, I know that there are, like, open water rescues with other canoes, and that’s a thing.
[0:12:33 – 0:12:33] Erik: But I don’t…
[0:12:34 – 0:12:35] Erik: I mean, maybe.
[0:12:35 – 0:12:36] Erik: Hey, fact check us.
[0:12:37 – 0:12:41] Erik: Is there a way to rescue yourself if it’s just one canoe out in the water?
[0:12:41 – 0:12:45] Adam: Wrangled the one end and tried to pop the other end up in the air to, like…
[0:12:46 – 0:13:14] Adam: clear as much of the the canoe as possible and then flip it and even then it was still half full of water yeah i mean maybe that’s something but no i don’t know i think to then try and get back in as soon as i tried to jump in i immediately let more water in and negated all the success i’d had earlier i mean it’s a real struggle and that was just like we didn’t even have packs to worry about you know we were right on shore yeah like but just for the sake of trying and
[0:13:16 – 0:13:17] Adam: Very, very tough to do.
[0:13:17 – 0:13:20] Erik: Yeah, we were in conditions that nobody would ever really capsize them.
[0:13:21 – 0:13:24] Erik: And it was a struggle to deal with the canoe.
[0:13:24 – 0:13:32] Erik: And I mean, in any conditions that people are actually going to be capsizing in, I imagine it would be pretty much impossible.
[0:13:33 – 0:13:57] Erik: to manage yourself the gear and the canoe out in the water so i think we kind of came to the conclusion you know we always you always hear like stay with the boat just stay with the boat and you’ll be fine but like if you’re out there and it’s the boat’s worthless the boat is pretty much worthless as far as i could tell yeah you like got back into it and then the back end just sank with you yeah that wasn’t any good
[0:13:58 – 0:14:07] Erik: Yeah, so we pretty much came to the conclusion that, you know, unless it’s, like, the middle of the summer and you can, I mean… You can afford to be in the water and goofing around.
[0:14:07 – 0:14:15] Erik: But, I mean, even then, like, if you’re in the middle of a lake, even sitting in the water for, like, an hour, like, you’re going to start getting cold.
[0:14:15 – 0:14:15] Erik: For sure.
[0:14:15 – 0:14:19] Erik: In the summer, but, yeah, so spring or fall, you dump a canoe…
[0:14:21 – 0:14:25] Erik: I think the idea that you should stick with your canoe is maybe not the greatest.
[0:14:25 – 0:14:25] Erik: Yeah.
[0:14:25 – 0:14:29] Adam: Don’t put yourself in the position where you’re away from shore too far.
[0:14:29 – 0:14:30] Erik: That’s the main lesson.
[0:14:30 – 0:14:30] Erik: Yeah.
[0:14:30 – 0:14:31] Erik: The first thing is…
[0:14:31 – 0:14:37] Adam: Stick by shore where you can just try and get the thing to shore and flip it over and clear it and then get your wet clothes off.
[0:14:38 – 0:14:39] Adam: That’s the way to do it.
[0:14:39 – 0:14:49] Adam: But if you do find yourself in the middle of the lake somehow into some rollers and you get sideways and flip it, like seriously, just leave the canoe.
[0:14:49 – 0:14:51] Erik: Abandon the canoe and grab a pant.
[0:14:51 – 0:14:58] Adam: The sooner you come to the conclusion that you’re not going to save this canoe or waste more energy trying to flip this canoe over.
[0:14:58 – 0:14:58] Erik: Yeah.
[0:14:59 – 0:15:21] Adam: um just leave the canoe and try and grab the pack with any dry clothing in it that you have and kick that thing like a paddleboard towards the nearest shoreline yeah and then just hope that somebody comes along and kind of hilariously while we were out there messing around with it a motorboat did go by and we’re like there they are saviors and i was kind of waving like fake waving at them yeah
[0:15:21 – 0:15:22] Adam: They had their back to us.
[0:15:22 – 0:15:23] Adam: They never saw us.
[0:15:23 – 0:15:23] Adam: Didn’t even see us.
[0:15:24 – 0:15:26] Erik: It was like the classic scene from like a shipwreck movie.
[0:15:26 – 0:15:27] Erik: The despair.
[0:15:27 – 0:15:29] Erik: Yeah, where you’re like waiting on a flame.
[0:15:29 – 0:15:30] Erik: I felt when they went around the corner.
[0:15:31 – 0:15:31] Erik: Yeah.
[0:15:31 – 0:15:32] SPEAKER_00: Help!
[0:15:32 – 0:15:33] Erik: Didn’t even notice us.
[0:15:34 – 0:15:39] Adam: I did kind of yell like an exaggerated scream for help.
[0:15:39 – 0:15:40] Adam: You gave a pretty good yell.
[0:15:40 – 0:15:42] Adam: And they, of course, didn’t hear us over the motor of their boat.
[0:15:42 – 0:15:42] Erik: Nope.
[0:15:42 – 0:15:43] Adam: Nope.
[0:15:43 – 0:15:53] Adam: So, yeah, don’t, you know, I think that’s your best move is just to abandon the boat, get to shore with some dry clothes and try and salvage it that way.
[0:15:54 – 0:16:01] Erik: Abandoning the boat is, like, worst case scenario, but, like, just saying no matter what, stay with the boat, I think is…
[0:16:02 – 0:16:03] Erik: Yeah, it seems crazy.
[0:16:03 – 0:16:06] Adam: Like your boat’s your way out, but not if you’re dead.
[0:16:06 – 0:16:06] Erik: Yeah, right.
[0:16:06 – 0:16:09] Erik: Don’t just hang out in the boat until you get tired and go to sleep.
[0:16:09 – 0:16:10] Adam: I’m tired.
[0:16:10 – 0:16:11] Erik: I’m getting so tired.
[0:16:11 – 0:16:11] Erik: It’s cold.
[0:16:12 – 0:16:12] Erik: Dad.
[0:16:13 – 0:16:14] Adam: Dad, I’m getting cold.
[0:16:16 – 0:16:29] Erik: Yeah, I mean, I think before you even get to that point, you should be as close to shore as possible in cold water situations and probably not be crossing anything that is potentially going to capsize you to begin with.
[0:16:30 – 0:16:33] Erik: And always wear your PFD.
[0:16:33 – 0:16:44] Adam: Yeah, we did have our PFDs on just in case, but as we noted on the field audio, which we opened the show with here, the boots didn’t really pose any problem whatsoever.
[0:16:44 – 0:16:45] Adam: No.
[0:16:45 – 0:16:47] Adam: So go ahead and wear your tall boots all you want.
[0:16:48 – 0:16:51] Adam: Honestly, the main problem was they were acting like balloons on my feet.
[0:16:51 – 0:16:52] Erik: Right away, yeah.
[0:16:52 – 0:16:55] Adam: Because they weren’t full of water, so I was kind of tipped forward.
[0:16:55 – 0:16:57] Adam: And had I not had my PFD on…
[0:16:58 – 0:17:01] Adam: I would have probably been struggling a little bit more to stay upright.
[0:17:01 – 0:17:05] Adam: But the real trick, if you do have the tall boots on, is just to let them fill up.
[0:17:06 – 0:17:07] Adam: Stick them down there and try and get them to fill up.
[0:17:07 – 0:17:10] Adam: Because then once they fill up, you kind of equalize.
[0:17:11 – 0:17:15] Adam: You’re able to actually operate like a normal person.
[0:17:15 – 0:17:20] Adam: Whereas before that, I was just kind of flailing around and all on the surface.
[0:17:20 – 0:17:21] Erik: Styrofoam boot situation.
[0:17:21 – 0:17:22] Adam: Yeah.
[0:17:22 – 0:17:24] Adam: So, yeah, those boots do float.
[0:17:25 – 0:17:27] Adam: But even when they were full, they were not an issue.
[0:17:28 – 0:17:30] Adam: We got out, took them off.
[0:17:30 – 0:17:31] Adam: You just dump the water right out and you’re good to go.
[0:17:32 – 0:17:35] Erik: Yeah, that was a very controlled capsize situation that we were in.
[0:17:35 – 0:17:39] Erik: And it was, I mean, it wasn’t worried at all, but it was like, it was a struggle.
[0:17:39 – 0:17:40] Erik: It was kind of a hassle dealing with that.
[0:17:40 – 0:17:43] Adam: The worst thing that happened was we both got like water in our ears.
[0:17:43 – 0:17:44] Erik: Oh, yeah.
[0:17:44 – 0:17:45] Erik: We’re both dealing with water in the ears.
[0:17:45 – 0:17:51] Adam: The sudden like slapping of the head into the side of the water really jams that whole pool water right in the ear.
[0:17:51 – 0:17:51] Erik: Yep.
[0:17:51 – 0:17:52] Erik: But I would be interested.
[0:17:52 – 0:17:58] Erik: I don’t know if it’s necessarily worthy of a question of the week at all, but send us an email.
[0:17:59 – 0:17:59] Erik: Call us.
[0:17:59 – 0:18:01] Adam: Do you have any capsizing situation?
[0:18:01 – 0:18:03] Erik: Yeah, call the peat line.
[0:18:04 – 0:18:12] Erik: I want to know if there’s any harrowing stories of like real life mid-like capsizing situations.
[0:18:12 – 0:18:13] Erik: I couldn’t imagine.
[0:18:13 – 0:18:13] Adam: I can’t imagine.
[0:18:13 – 0:18:14] Erik: It’s got to be terrifying.
[0:18:15 – 0:18:16] Adam: I would probably never canoe again.
[0:18:16 – 0:18:17] Adam: No.
[0:18:17 – 0:18:21] Adam: Capsize in the middle of, like, Cache Bay in the fall.
[0:18:21 – 0:18:23] Adam: Never canoe again because you’re dead.
[0:18:23 – 0:18:23] Adam: That’s right.
[0:18:24 – 0:18:25] Erik: You’ll never do anything again.
[0:18:26 – 0:18:28] Erik: Never taste sweet, sweet Radler ever again.
[0:18:29 – 0:18:31] Erik: So, yeah.
[0:18:31 – 0:18:39] Erik: Before we move on to our little discussion on the rules and regulations of the park…
[0:18:40 – 0:18:44] Erik: I have a couple of little things I’d throw at you.
[0:18:45 – 0:18:46] Erik: Started a new book today.
[0:18:47 – 0:18:48] Adam: I’m on a new book myself.
[0:18:50 – 0:18:50] Erik: Fiction?
[0:18:51 – 0:18:51] Adam: Yes.
[0:18:52 – 0:18:53] Erik: Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
[0:18:53 – 0:18:54] Erik: Mine’s non-fiction.
[0:18:55 – 0:18:56] Adam: We’re not going to talk about my book.
[0:18:56 – 0:18:57] Adam: What are you reading?
[0:18:57 – 0:18:57] Adam: Okay.
[0:18:58 – 0:19:00] Erik: I am reading Welcome to the Universe.
[0:19:01 – 0:19:03] Erik: It’s by a few different guys.
[0:19:03 – 0:19:04] Erik: Neil deGrasse Tyson.
[0:19:05 – 0:19:31] Erik: few other guys that have names that i don’t know if they do it on purpose or if they’re really like that serious about it but it seems like all these scientists guys are like i can’t just have a regular name right i’m not just neil i’m neil degrasse tyson and i’m michael a strauss and then j just j period yeah like the initial first name yeah it’s an uh it’s an astrophysical tour
[0:19:32 – 0:19:37] Adam: When I worked at the college newspaper, my pen name was MTH Mella.
[0:19:38 – 0:19:41] Adam: Only three initials, none of which were legit.
[0:19:42 – 0:19:42] Adam: Oh, wow.
[0:19:42 – 0:19:43] Adam: None of them were?
[0:19:43 – 0:19:45] Adam: Well, actually, Michael was.
[0:19:45 – 0:19:53] Adam: My middle name is Michael, so M was for Michael, and then it was Michael Twelves Hughes Mella was the pen name.
[0:19:54 – 0:19:55] Adam: I’ve said too much.
[0:19:55 – 0:19:57] Erik: You’ve already said way too much.
[0:19:57 – 0:19:59] Adam: I’m a big fan of crazy pen names, but…
[0:20:00 – 0:20:01] Adam: Yeah, I don’t know.
[0:20:01 – 0:20:03] Adam: They do all have goofy names.
[0:20:03 – 0:20:04] Adam: So what’s it about?
[0:20:04 – 0:20:15] Erik: I mean, I’m only a few chapters in, but it’s pretty much just a layman’s explanation on the basics of kind of…
[0:20:16 – 0:20:22] Erik: The day-to-day workings of the universe gives you an idea on like what the real scale is on things.
[0:20:23 – 0:20:31] Erik: But, you know, it also explains a lot of things that you just kind of take for granted and like you just assume, well, yeah, that’s how it works.
[0:20:31 – 0:20:33] Erik: But they actually kind of explain it.
[0:20:33 – 0:20:35] Erik: You’re like, well, that actually makes more sense.
[0:20:35 – 0:20:36] Erik: Yeah.
[0:20:36 – 0:20:38] Adam: How do three people write a book together?
[0:20:39 – 0:20:40] Erik: I don’t think they wrote a book together.
[0:20:40 – 0:20:42] Erik: I think they just wrote individual chapters.
[0:20:42 – 0:20:42] Erik: Oh, okay.
[0:20:42 – 0:20:44] Erik: And then they probably, like, conferred.
[0:20:44 – 0:20:45] Erik: That makes way more sense.
[0:20:45 – 0:20:47] Erik: And said, you know, I’ll take this, this, and this.
[0:20:47 – 0:20:48] Adam: Maybe they worked on the outline together.
[0:20:48 – 0:20:49] Adam: Yeah.
[0:20:49 – 0:20:51] Adam: And they’re like, hey, Neil.
[0:20:51 – 0:20:54] Erik: Yeah, it’s not really like a book necessarily.
[0:20:54 – 0:21:01] Erik: It seems like more of a collection of essays in particular order on particular subjects.
[0:21:01 – 0:21:26] Erik: okay um i’m gonna do i’m gonna ask you a question and then i’m just gonna say the other thing that i kind of learned today that was interesting um do you know what the brightest star in the sky is the international space station no i don’t know how that would compare that’s an interesting aspect of that magnitude i believe when like it’s directly overhead it’s amongst the brightest objects in the night sky but it doesn’t make it a star yeah
[0:21:27 – 0:21:28] Erik: No, I don’t.
[0:21:29 – 0:21:34] Erik: So the topic of that was everybody just assumes that the North Star is.
[0:21:34 – 0:21:35] Erik: It’s not, no.
[0:21:35 – 0:21:38] Erik: It’s the 45th brightest star in the sky.
[0:21:39 – 0:21:40] Erik: That’s not bad, though.
[0:21:40 – 0:21:41] Erik: No, it’s not bad.
[0:21:41 – 0:21:43] Adam: 45th is a pretty high ranking for a star.
[0:21:43 – 0:21:44] Erik: Yeah.
[0:21:45 – 0:21:46] Erik: Sirius, the dog star.
[0:21:47 – 0:21:49] Erik: That is the brightest star in the sky.
[0:21:50 – 0:21:52] Erik: The other thing that, I mean, I don’t know.
[0:21:52 – 0:21:55] Erik: I might be saying things that everybody’s just like, yeah, yeah, whatever.
[0:21:55 – 0:21:55] Erik: I know all this.
[0:21:55 – 0:22:00] Erik: But I kind of feel like I learned these two things so far.
[0:22:01 – 0:22:05] Erik: The second one was the Zodiac calendar.
[0:22:05 – 0:22:35] Erik: yes um and its relationship with uh you know the newspaper and telling you that you’re gonna either have a good day or a bad day i was right on the edge uh for my birthday so i was technically one but then i always would read the other one and i always felt like i was i should have been born two days earlier you could even you could split hairs even more to make it make it uh reflect your reality even more if you wanted yeah
[0:22:36 – 0:22:51] Erik: But anyway, so, I mean, it’s generally a joke, that calendar and how it relates to people’s birthdays, especially even now because of the fact that when that calendar…
[0:22:53 – 0:23:20] Erik: was uh made up they assumed that there was the sun had 12 you know different stages and it moves through these different constellations in the sky but it was written at a time before they understood that the the earth actually has a wobble to it so there’s actually 13 so everybody’s zodiac symbol is off a month i knew it was off
[0:23:20 – 0:23:21] Erik: Yeah.
[0:23:21 – 0:23:25] Erik: And so there’s a 13th one, and it is Ophiuchus.
[0:23:26 – 0:23:28] Erik: So there’s a 13th zodiac symbol.
[0:23:29 – 0:23:29] Erik: What?
[0:23:29 – 0:23:34] Erik: And it’s actually, I think it’s right around when, for Scorpios.
[0:23:35 – 0:23:37] Erik: I was going to say, was it in August of 1980?
[0:23:37 – 0:23:37] Erik: No.
[0:23:37 – 0:23:37] Erik: One?
[0:23:38 – 0:23:38] Erik: No?
[0:23:38 – 0:23:38] Erik: Ugh.
[0:23:41 – 0:23:43] Erik: Yeah, so there’s actually 13 of those.
[0:23:45 – 0:23:50] Erik: So if only somebody would have put together the Zodiac calendar.
[0:23:51 – 0:23:54] Erik: Well, this goes back to, aren’t we going to have 13 months of 28 days too?
[0:23:55 – 0:23:57] Erik: Well, yeah, that was another conversation we had about adjusting the calendar.
[0:23:57 – 0:23:59] Adam: See, it all comes back to 13s.
[0:23:59 – 0:23:59] Adam: Yep.
[0:24:00 – 0:24:00] Erik: Boo 12s.
[0:24:01 – 0:24:01] Erik: Yep.
[0:24:02 – 0:24:03] Adam: Forget the 12s.
[0:24:03 – 0:24:03] Adam: Yep.
[0:24:03 – 0:24:04] Adam: We need the 13s.
[0:24:04 – 0:24:08] Adam: My pen name should have been Michael 13s Hughes Mella.
[0:24:08 – 0:24:08] Adam: Yeah.
[0:24:11 – 0:24:17] Erik: I also learned in the first few chapters today that that’s where month came from.
[0:24:17 – 0:24:18] Erik: It used to be called moonth.
[0:24:19 – 0:24:19] Adam: No.
[0:24:20 – 0:24:20] Adam: Really?
[0:24:20 – 0:24:23] Adam: That’s the best fact you’ve thrown out in the entire podcast.
[0:24:24 – 0:24:24] Adam: Really?
[0:24:24 – 0:24:24] Adam: Yeah.
[0:24:25 – 0:24:27] Adam: I’m never calling it month again.
[0:24:27 – 0:24:28] Erik: It’s moonth.
[0:24:28 – 0:24:28] Erik: Yeah.
[0:24:29 – 0:24:33] Erik: Based on the lunar cycle, they were referred to as moonths.
[0:24:34 – 0:24:34] Adam: Wow.
[0:24:34 – 0:24:34] Adam: Yeah.
[0:24:35 – 0:24:36] Adam: Well, that made my day.
[0:24:36 – 0:24:37] Adam: Let’s just end the episode on a high note.
[0:24:37 – 0:24:40] Adam: Let’s just start reading verbatim out of this book.
[0:24:40 – 0:24:40] UNKNOWN: What’s this?
[0:24:40 – 0:24:58] Adam: pass the book back and forth this is the new podcast yep we’re just gonna purposely capsize and then read you science books record scratch welcome to the universe july it’s my favorite moon for capsizes well we’re off to a real a real start here yeah we are
[0:25:00 – 0:25:07] Erik: So we are, as previously mentioned, going to talk about the rules, the regulations.
[0:25:07 – 0:25:09] Erik: That kind of sounds boring though, right?
[0:25:10 – 0:25:13] Adam: Yeah, well, you know, but we can have fun with it.
[0:25:13 – 0:25:14] Erik: Yes, that’s the point.
[0:25:15 – 0:25:27] Erik: We are going to, if we haven’t already been blacklisted by the U.S. Forest Service, we will be on this episode because we were criticizing and critiquing the rules and regulations of
[0:25:28 – 0:25:29] Erik: The Bouncy Waters Canoe Area Wilderness.
[0:25:29 – 0:25:30] Adam: They’re a government entity.
[0:25:30 – 0:25:32] Adam: They can take criticism.
[0:25:32 – 0:25:33] Adam: They better be able to.
[0:25:33 – 0:25:34] Adam: They’re not really listening.
[0:25:34 – 0:25:35] Adam: They’re not going to hear it.
[0:25:35 – 0:25:35] Erik: No.
[0:25:36 – 0:25:49] Erik: They are… Yeah, so the… Just to clear the air, we haven’t read any of the responses yet, and we will actually be reading them and responding to them in a couple of days.
[0:25:49 – 0:25:52] Erik: We want to give some people enough time to respond to those.
[0:25:52 – 0:25:52] Erik: So…
[0:25:54 – 0:25:56] Erik: These are basically…
[0:25:56 – 0:25:58] Adam: The early returns look good.
[0:25:58 – 0:26:05] Adam: We haven’t been really checking them out yet, but we have good response rates on both Facebook and Reddit.
[0:26:05 – 0:26:06] Erik: High volume.
[0:26:06 – 0:26:06] Erik: Who knows?
[0:26:06 – 0:26:07] Erik: High volume.
[0:26:07 – 0:26:09] Adam: So we have a lot to talk about later in the week, but…
[0:26:09 – 0:26:12] Adam: We just wanted to get together and capsize canoes today.
[0:26:12 – 0:26:13] Adam: It’s a nice day.
[0:26:13 – 0:26:17] Adam: It’s supposed to cool off, and we just wanted to enjoy the water and kind of just go over the rules.
[0:26:17 – 0:26:18] Adam: What are the rules?
[0:26:18 – 0:26:26] Erik: Yeah, the day we were planning on recording, it was supposed to be 66 and rainy, so we bumped up capsize day a few days.
[0:26:27 – 0:26:30] Erik: So we’re going to give our own opinions on some of these rules and regulations.
[0:26:30 – 0:26:33] Erik: I think for the most part, I’ll start.
[0:26:33 – 0:26:38] Erik: I think the rules and regulations that are set up in place before I get into the individual ones…
[0:26:40 – 0:26:42] Erik: They’re as good as they can be.
[0:26:44 – 0:26:48] Erik: It’s such a unique area to be able to try to manage.
[0:26:48 – 0:26:51] Adam: I sure wouldn’t want the job of writing these rules.
[0:26:51 – 0:26:52] Erik: No.
[0:26:52 – 0:27:00] Adam: What poor bureaucrat out there had to write these rules and then pass them through seven different committees and get them all approved to get to this final product?
[0:27:00 – 0:27:02] Adam: I’m sure it wasn’t an easy process.
[0:27:02 – 0:27:02] Erik: No.
[0:27:03 – 0:27:04] Adam: And I sure wouldn’t want that.
[0:27:04 – 0:27:30] Erik: yeah i think yeah before we even go any further i don’t think that uh i don’t think that we’re we’re not doing this episode to say that any of them are horrible or that the whole system is bad i think it’s just a kind of fun conversation yeah i mean everybody who goes in the park gets this permit with these rules on the back of them and everybody’s got to take the little quiz and watch the video but like how many of you have actually read through the rules with a fine comb like this
[0:27:31 – 0:27:31] Erik: Yeah, right.
[0:27:31 – 0:27:36] Erik: So yeah, just let it be known, U.S. Forest Service, please don’t blacklist us.
[0:27:36 – 0:27:37] Erik: We respect you.
[0:27:37 – 0:27:41] Erik: Yeah, we think that in general, they’re good rules.
[0:27:42 – 0:27:48] Erik: I don’t know how I would do it any differently necessarily, maybe a couple of things here or there, but it’s nitpicky.
[0:27:48 – 0:27:57] Erik: I mean, honestly, trying to manage the number of campsites that are out there, the usage over the course of a year, especially as it fluctuates with the seasons, is really hard.
[0:27:57 – 0:27:58] Erik: Yeah.
[0:27:58 – 0:28:11] Erik: And that kind of goes to the first rule, which is entering at an entry point on an entry date and how that affects the usage beyond where you enter.
[0:28:12 – 0:28:15] Erik: I think this is probably, for me, the thing that can…
[0:28:16 – 0:28:42] Erik: be improved on the most but at the same time i don’t necessarily know how it would be or could be the quota system it’s really tough because 10 months out of the year it’s basically a non-issue pretty much yeah but july and august in particular in some specific areas it’s uh control that horde yeah it’s really tough because you hashtag horde control yeah
[0:28:43 – 0:28:44] Adam: Sorry, Boy Scouts.
[0:28:45 – 0:28:46] Erik: Sorry, Boy Scouts.
[0:28:46 – 0:28:49] Adam: We’re not going to really be in trouble with the Forest Service by the end of this podcast.
[0:28:49 – 0:28:53] Adam: By episode 999, we’re going to be really in trouble with the Boy Scouts of America.
[0:28:53 – 0:28:55] Erik: You’re telling me we’re not going to get invited to the Jamboree?
[0:28:56 – 0:28:56] Adam: Never.
[0:28:56 – 0:28:57] Adam: Never again.
[0:28:57 – 0:28:57] Adam: Man.
[0:28:57 – 0:28:58] Adam: No.
[0:28:58 – 0:29:00] Adam: The last time was the first time and the last time.
[0:29:00 – 0:29:01] Adam: Heh.
[0:29:01 – 0:29:06] Erik: So, I mean, I think at this point, people that are listening to this, they understand the basics.
[0:29:06 – 0:29:13] Erik: But the trouble with the quota system in terms of individual entry points is where people go once they enter.
[0:29:14 – 0:29:20] Erik: You know, you could be on a two-day trip where you’re entering at Clearwater Lake.
[0:29:21 – 0:29:27] Erik: and you’re going to go camp down at the end of the lake, and you’d be like, oh, well, there’s only two other groups that could have entered in on this day.
[0:29:27 – 0:29:29] Erik: There’s seven campsites on the lake.
[0:29:29 – 0:29:30] Erik: I should be…
[0:29:30 – 0:29:41] Erik: There’s no problem with me finding a campsite, but who’s to say somebody didn’t enter in four days prior over at North Fowl, and they’re doing a loop, and they’re over at Clearwater.
[0:29:41 – 0:29:44] Adam: Yeah, it’s really hard to say where everybody’s going to end up.
[0:29:45 – 0:29:46] Erik: And it’s pretty much…
[0:29:47 – 0:29:53] Erik: I would say impossible to try to manage it in any other way besides the one that we fantasize about.
[0:29:54 – 0:29:55] Adam: Yes, the fantasy map.
[0:29:55 – 0:29:57] Erik: The fantasy map.
[0:29:57 – 0:29:57] Erik: Yes.
[0:29:57 – 0:29:59] Adam: It’s like Harry Potter got that map.
[0:29:59 – 0:30:04] Adam: And you can see where everybody’s location was throughout Hogwarts.
[0:30:05 – 0:30:06] Adam: It fits in his pocket.
[0:30:06 – 0:30:07] Adam: You can quick sneak a look.
[0:30:07 – 0:30:11] Adam: Who’s up in the room of…
[0:30:11 – 0:30:14] Erik: There’s people probably yelling at their speakers right now.
[0:30:14 – 0:30:15] Erik: We’re messing this up so bad.
[0:30:15 – 0:30:16] Erik: What the name of that map is.
[0:30:16 – 0:30:16] Adam: Yeah.
[0:30:17 – 0:30:19] Adam: Well, you know the map we’re talking about, though.
[0:30:19 – 0:30:26] Adam: But, like, that would be you got your Nat Geo out, and then you see, okay, the campsite up here has still got a green light on it.
[0:30:26 – 0:30:28] Adam: But then, oh, bloop, it just turned red.
[0:30:28 – 0:30:28] Erik: Yeah.
[0:30:29 – 0:30:33] Erik: I wouldn’t necessarily think that knowing the location of every canoe would be advantageous.
[0:30:33 – 0:30:34] Erik: I don’t want to know that.
[0:30:35 – 0:30:48] Erik: But it would be, like, I mean, I think this would totally take away from the experience in general, but this is the only thing I can think of to make the quota system go away, and that would be having, like, a little activator switch.
[0:30:48 – 0:30:48] Erik: Yeah.
[0:30:48 – 0:30:54] Erik: at every campsite that when you checked in, you just flipped the switch and then the campsite disappeared from the map.
[0:30:54 – 0:30:56] Adam: People do this to some extent.
[0:30:56 – 0:30:58] Adam: They’ll hang a flag or something.
[0:30:58 – 0:31:00] Adam: You’ll purposely put your water filter…
[0:31:02 – 0:31:23] Adam: gravity system out like on the point yeah so somebody can see it from a ways off maybe a ways off but not like lakes away right not lakes away you know this would be a way to do it yeah do we also get an invisibility cloak that’s yeah that’s did you know here’s my fun fact i just found out oh here we go fun fact the pool at hogwarts had a giant squid
[0:31:24 – 0:31:25] Erik: I don’t remember that.
[0:31:25 – 0:31:25] Erik: Why?
[0:31:25 – 0:31:27] Adam: And they’re like, well, Hagrid, obviously.
[0:31:27 – 0:31:31] Adam: He brought it in somehow, and then Dumbledore’s like, whatever, just put it in the lake.
[0:31:32 – 0:31:33] Erik: I thought it was a pool.
[0:31:33 – 0:31:34] Adam: No, it’s the lake.
[0:31:34 – 0:31:35] Adam: In the lake.
[0:31:35 – 0:31:35] Adam: Oh, yeah.
[0:31:35 – 0:31:36] Adam: I’m continuing the pool joke.
[0:31:36 – 0:31:37] Erik: Okay, all right.
[0:31:37 – 0:31:39] Erik: I knew that there was a squid in the lake.
[0:31:40 – 0:31:40] Adam: I didn’t know.
[0:31:40 – 0:31:41] Adam: I read all of them.
[0:31:41 – 0:31:44] Adam: I just read them, and I did not remember the giant squid in the lake.
[0:31:45 – 0:31:46] Adam: Anyways.
[0:31:46 – 0:31:47] Erik: Well, you threw me off with pool.
[0:31:47 – 0:31:50] Erik: I was like, I definitely don’t remember a pool, like the swimming laps.
[0:31:50 – 0:31:53] Adam: Yeah, the big pool where those Germans came out with their big boat.
[0:31:55 – 0:31:56] Erik: Oh, yeah.
[0:31:56 – 0:31:57] Adam: And the merpeople.
[0:31:58 – 0:31:59] Adam: Oh, God, there’s so many.
[0:31:59 – 0:32:05] Adam: We should just do an episode on Harry Potter and how it relates to the Boundary Waters, maybe in season five.
[0:32:05 – 0:32:05] Erik: Yeah.
[0:32:05 – 0:32:10] Adam: But anyways, so we got this map, and then you get to see, okay, these campsites are all open.
[0:32:10 – 0:32:11] Adam: Yeah.
[0:32:11 – 0:32:12] Adam: I’m not sure it would help.
[0:32:12 – 0:32:17] Adam: You’d still have to have the quota system, but at least it would give you a little bit more idea on how to plan your day.
[0:32:17 – 0:32:18] Erik: I think it would probably…
[0:32:18 – 0:32:21] Erik: I don’t think it would alleviate the need for the quota system.
[0:32:21 – 0:32:26] Adam: I think we’re really overblowing the idea that, like, oh, I’m out there and I can’t find a campsite.
[0:32:26 – 0:32:27] Adam: Like, you’ll eventually find a campsite.
[0:32:27 – 0:32:29] Adam: You may not get the one you wanted.
[0:32:29 – 0:32:30] Erik: Oh, boo-hoo.
[0:32:30 – 0:32:33] Erik: Yeah, it’s just one of those conversations that we have when we’re out there.
[0:32:33 – 0:32:33] Adam: That would be cool, though.
[0:32:34 – 0:32:40] Erik: It would be like, you know, you go to the Forest Service ranger station or a cooperator and…
[0:32:40 – 0:32:44] Erik: Along with your permit, you get issued this little device.
[0:32:44 – 0:32:55] Erik: It’s like a GPS device, and it’s hooked up to all of these actuators that are at each individual campsite that people flip when they go to them.
[0:32:56 – 0:32:58] Erik: And then you know, hey, maybe let’s change our day.
[0:32:59 – 0:33:01] Erik: There’s no campsites available at the end of Clearwater.
[0:33:01 – 0:33:03] Erik: But then there’s always the human error.
[0:33:03 – 0:33:04] Erik: It would have to be robotic.
[0:33:04 – 0:33:07] Adam: Or people would leave the actuator actuated.
[0:33:07 – 0:33:13] Erik: Well, you know, it would have to be like, yeah, if somebody engages like a white switch on a tent pad.
[0:33:13 – 0:33:14] Adam: It should be on the box.
[0:33:15 – 0:33:20] Adam: If that thing has been sat on in the last 15 minutes, then the light remains red.
[0:33:20 – 0:33:20] Adam: Yes.
[0:33:20 – 0:33:22] Adam: But then after, if nobody’s used the…
[0:33:25 – 0:33:28] Adam: If nobody’s used the dumper in the last two hours, then the switch goes green.
[0:33:29 – 0:33:29] Adam: Yeah.
[0:33:29 – 0:33:30] Erik: There you go.
[0:33:30 – 0:33:31] Erik: Wow.
[0:33:32 – 0:33:34] Adam: But anyway, I don’t want to have a GPS thing.
[0:33:34 – 0:33:36] Adam: I think we’re getting farther in the rules and we’re going to talk.
[0:33:36 – 0:33:38] Adam: I don’t want to have more electronic devices.
[0:33:38 – 0:33:40] Adam: I want it to be on a magical paper map.
[0:33:40 – 0:33:42] Erik: That would be the only way to have it work.
[0:33:42 – 0:33:43] Adam: That you can hide in your cloak.
[0:33:43 – 0:33:47] Erik: I definitely don’t want any of the things that I just described to actually happen.
[0:33:48 – 0:33:52] Erik: Those are just the fun things that we talk about where we’d be like, well… Yeah.
[0:33:52 – 0:34:01] Adam: You know, the other fun thing I always think about is like, what if I could just drain this lake and pause everything, like pause all the fish and then drain the lake and I could just walk around…
[0:34:02 – 0:34:10] Adam: on the bottom of the lake and see all the cool lures and the huge fish, there’s probably a 14-foot lake trout in Clearwater right now that nobody’s ever going to catch.
[0:34:11 – 0:34:16] Adam: You would be able to see it if just for 15 minutes you could wander around in an empty Clearwater lake.
[0:34:16 – 0:34:17] Adam: How cool would that be?
[0:34:17 – 0:34:18] Erik: That would be very cool.
[0:34:18 – 0:34:23] Adam: I’d rather have that magical power than the ability to see which campsites were taken or not.
[0:34:23 – 0:34:28] Erik: I’ve definitely fantasized about that too, just to drain a lake to see what it looks like.
[0:34:29 – 0:34:38] Adam: That actually happened when I was living in Madison, this stupid impoundment lake up in the Dells, really bad rain, and then it burst the dam.
[0:34:38 – 0:34:40] Adam: And so this lake just basically drained.
[0:34:40 – 0:34:43] Adam: And then there’s all these fish just flopping around in the mud.
[0:34:43 – 0:34:46] Adam: And people are trying to go out to save the fish, got all stuck in the mud.
[0:34:47 – 0:34:49] Adam: You don’t even have to fact check me on this one.
[0:34:49 – 0:34:49] Adam: It happened.
[0:34:49 – 0:34:52] Erik: But it was a dam, though.
[0:34:52 – 0:34:53] Erik: It was a reservoir.
[0:34:53 – 0:34:53] Adam: It was an impoundment.
[0:34:53 – 0:34:54] Adam: It’s not a real lake.
[0:34:54 – 0:34:55] Erik: So that’s not as fun.
[0:34:55 – 0:34:56] Erik: It’s not as fun.
[0:34:56 – 0:34:58] Erik: Yeah, look at all these dead trees that got flooded out.
[0:34:58 – 0:34:59] Adam: Yeah, gross.
[0:34:59 – 0:35:00] Adam: All this litter.
[0:35:00 – 0:35:01] Adam: Yeah.
[0:35:02 – 0:35:04] Erik: Well, now that it took us 10 minutes to talk about rule one.
[0:35:04 – 0:35:06] Adam: Rule one, fantasy.
[0:35:06 – 0:35:08] Adam: Let’s just fantasy tangent.
[0:35:08 – 0:35:10] Erik: Yeah, this is going to be a three-hour podcast.
[0:35:11 – 0:35:12] Adam: Stick with us.
[0:35:12 – 0:35:13] Adam: Hang with us.
[0:35:13 – 0:35:14] Adam: All right, rule two.
[0:35:16 – 0:35:36] Erik: designated campsites i think uh for the for what for the usage that the banjo artist gets designated campsites has to be a thing and there’s already people i’ve seen in the past where you’re just like paddling down a shore like there’s some smoke coming out of the woods there and there’s definitely not a campsite they’re having lunch yeah there’s nothing against a lunch spot
[0:35:37 – 0:35:44] Erik: I mean, and we’ve talked in the past before with Quetico, and technically you can camp wherever you want, but people just find the spaces that work best anyway.
[0:35:45 – 0:35:48] Adam: That will naturally filter people into the real campsites.
[0:35:49 – 0:35:49] Erik: Yeah.
[0:35:49 – 0:35:50] Erik: I don’t think that there’s much to change there.
[0:35:50 – 0:35:55] Adam: You can get some bozos camping on that point that’s not really a campsite or on that island, but…
[0:35:56 – 0:35:58] Adam: For the most part, people get that, and that’s not a big deal.
[0:35:59 – 0:36:01] Adam: And, yeah, the campsites are there.
[0:36:01 – 0:36:02] Adam: They’re there for a reason.
[0:36:03 – 0:36:03] Adam: It’s a good spot.
[0:36:04 – 0:36:04] Erik: Exactly.
[0:36:04 – 0:36:05] Erik: Mostly.
[0:36:05 – 0:36:07] Erik: Except, what, Winchell 10.
[0:36:08 – 0:36:09] Adam: Vista 3.
[0:36:09 – 0:36:10] Adam: Oh, yeah.
[0:36:10 – 0:36:10] Adam: No, Vista.
[0:36:10 – 0:36:11] Adam: I guess it would be Vista 1.
[0:36:12 – 0:36:13] Erik: Vista 1 on the west, that western arm.
[0:36:13 – 0:36:13] Erik: Vista 1.
[0:36:14 – 0:36:16] Adam: Oof, I can’t believe I ended up there one night.
[0:36:16 – 0:36:17] Adam: Well, coming soon.
[0:36:17 – 0:36:19] Adam: Cried myself to sleep in my hammock that night.
[0:36:19 – 0:36:20] Adam: Couldn’t even ride.
[0:36:20 – 0:36:21] Adam: Vista campsite reviews.
[0:36:21 – 0:36:21] Adam: Yeah.
[0:36:22 – 0:36:28] Erik: The third rule on the back of the permit, is it okay to cut, peel, or deface a tree or shrub?
[0:36:28 – 0:36:34] Adam: If you answer yes to that one, do you get kicked out by your pants and thrown out the front step?
[0:36:34 – 0:36:35] Erik: Get out.
[0:36:35 – 0:36:47] Erik: The only thing I’ll say about that one is, seriously, what is with people cutting trees down a foot off the ground that are clearly alive or just gouging out birch trees to peel bark?
[0:36:48 – 0:36:51] Adam: People aren’t all connoisseurs on firewood and what’s good in it.
[0:36:51 – 0:36:54] Adam: Some people honestly probably think that’s a good firewood.
[0:36:54 – 0:36:54] Adam: I don’t know.
[0:36:54 – 0:36:55] Adam: How else do you explain it?
[0:36:56 – 0:37:05] Erik: The only other thing that I can think that it would explain it, which is somewhat timely, I got an email, a newsletter from the U.S. Forest Service.
[0:37:05 – 0:37:06] Adam: Bulletin.
[0:37:06 – 0:37:06] Adam: Thank you.
[0:37:07 – 0:37:24] Erik: And one of the things that they mentioned in it was specifically the things that we were just talking about, the destruction, pointless destruction of live trees, hatcheting into trees that are way too big to be hatcheted down and peeling off birch bark.
[0:37:25 – 0:37:30] Erik: A lot of times, I don’t think it’s necessarily people doing it for the firewood.
[0:37:30 – 0:37:31] Erik: I think it’s just people that are bored.
[0:37:31 – 0:37:31] Erik: Yeah.
[0:37:32 – 0:37:37] Erik: And that was one of the things that the U.S. Forest Service, this newsletter was suggesting was…
[0:37:39 – 0:37:43] Erik: I think people get out there and they don’t expect how much time they’re going to have on their hands.
[0:37:43 – 0:37:53] Erik: And especially if you’ve got like kids or people who just kind of don’t really know what to do with the boundary waters, they end up to kind of just, you know, idle hands.
[0:37:54 – 0:37:56] Erik: Just going to start hacking away at this tree, whatever.
[0:37:57 – 0:38:00] Adam: Did you see on Brule on Shock Mock Island when we were out there?
[0:38:00 – 0:38:02] Adam: It was the last morning when we were packing up to leave.
[0:38:02 – 0:38:05] Adam: I noticed there’s a bunch of trees kind of down by the landing that,
[0:38:06 – 0:38:29] Erik: clearly somebody had a hatchet throwing contest oh yeah yeah for sure live trees real cool guys yeah and it i mean it totally makes sense it’s like yeah the barge waters isn’t going to entertain you on its own so don’t just bring a hatchet and plan on entertaining yourself with that so um bring some past the pigs bring a book yeah bring a book bring a neil degrasse tyson book
[0:38:30 – 0:38:31] Erik: Firewood, yeah.
[0:38:31 – 0:38:33] Erik: What should you gather and from where?
[0:38:34 – 0:38:35] Erik: Well away from camp, well out of sight.
[0:38:36 – 0:38:38] Erik: I think there’s a whole episode we can have on firewood.
[0:38:38 – 0:38:39] Adam: We should.
[0:38:39 – 0:38:41] Adam: Yeah, let’s just pop on by that one.
[0:38:41 – 0:38:43] Adam: Come back to that one in season two.
[0:38:43 – 0:38:44] Erik: We kind of just talked about it.
[0:38:44 – 0:38:45] Erik: Yeah, live trees don’t burn.
[0:38:47 – 0:38:48] Erik: Where can you have a fire?
[0:38:48 – 0:38:52] Erik: This is one of the biggest things about the Bonjewaters versus Quetico.
[0:38:53 – 0:38:55] Erik: Bonjewaters, you got to have those in a fire grate.
[0:38:55 – 0:38:58] Erik: My biggest gripe with that is a lot of times those things get so…
[0:38:59 – 0:39:17] Erik: filled with ashes and like surrounded by rocks that you’re basically working with about like four inches of space but I get it the amount of usage I wouldn’t want people just having open fires could you imagine what sites would look like if it was just have a campfire wherever you want I mean I’ve seen it though
[0:39:18 – 0:39:20] Adam: People are just like, whatever, I’m too good for that fire grade.
[0:39:20 – 0:39:22] Adam: I’m going to just start one out here.
[0:39:22 – 0:39:31] Erik: I’ve seen a surprising increase in my day trips over the last couple of years in campfires just at portage landings too.
[0:39:31 – 0:39:32] Erik: Yeah, what?
[0:39:32 – 0:39:38] Erik: I saw one going across the mountain lake portage, right where it intersects the- Yeah, I remember that.
[0:39:38 – 0:39:40] Adam: Yeah, right where it intersects the border route trail.
[0:39:40 – 0:39:42] Adam: Yeah, I must have been a border route hiker.
[0:39:42 – 0:39:43] Adam: Yeah.
[0:39:43 – 0:39:44] Adam: Can’t go any further.
[0:39:44 – 0:39:44] Adam: Yeah.
[0:39:44 – 0:39:47] Erik: Let’s just have a small little campfire.
[0:39:47 – 0:39:49] Adam: Got to have Mecano beans right here.
[0:39:50 – 0:39:51] Erik: Yeah.
[0:39:51 – 0:39:55] Erik: The nine-person rule and four-watercraft rule, I think, I don’t know.
[0:39:56 – 0:39:57] Erik: I don’t have much to say on that.
[0:39:58 – 0:39:59] Erik: It seems kind of arbitrary.
[0:39:59 – 0:40:00] Erik: Yeah.
[0:40:00 – 0:40:05] Adam: I would love to know how they came to that one, but I actually don’t.
[0:40:05 – 0:40:12] Adam: You can’t see my eyes rolling, but they’re rolling backwards into my head on that one.
[0:40:12 – 0:40:12] Adam: How?
[0:40:12 – 0:40:13] Erik: I don’t know.
[0:40:13 – 0:40:13] Erik: Nine.
[0:40:13 – 0:40:14] Erik: Why nine?
[0:40:15 – 0:40:15] Erik: An odd number?
[0:40:16 – 0:40:17] Erik: Yeah, an odd number, but still four canoes.
[0:40:18 – 0:40:20] Erik: Yeah, I don’t know.
[0:40:20 – 0:40:29] Erik: I prefer just off the top of my head to have fewer, but I think it’s so hard to try to.
[0:40:30 – 0:40:41] Adam: I think this is going to be a point where people are going to, like in the comments on this question of the week, I think the group size limit is probably going to be one of the more talked about points in the rules.
[0:40:41 – 0:40:43] Erik: You have wild animals on the roof back there.
[0:40:43 – 0:40:45] Adam: I can see people saying there should be more.
[0:40:45 – 0:40:49] Adam: I can also see a lot of people saying there should be less than nine.
[0:40:49 – 0:40:50] Adam: I don’t want to see groups of nine.
[0:40:51 – 0:40:53] Adam: I think, oh, but maybe we should have a group of 16.
[0:40:54 – 0:40:56] Adam: I can see people arguing either point.
[0:40:56 – 0:40:57] Erik: Oh, yeah, for sure.
[0:40:57 – 0:41:00] Erik: And I mean, I guess maybe that’s why it’s at nine.
[0:41:00 – 0:41:06] Adam: You know, but if I’m being honest with myself, when I see a group of nine in the park, I’m always like, oh, my God.
[0:41:07 – 0:41:07] Erik: Yeah.
[0:41:07 – 0:41:08] Adam: Look at this circus.
[0:41:08 – 0:41:09] Erik: I feel the same way.
[0:41:09 – 0:41:13] Adam: I mean, that’s how a lot of the youngsters get into it, and that’s important, too.
[0:41:13 – 0:41:19] Adam: But I think we’re going to have to come back to this one once we get to the comments, because I feel like this one’s going to be hit on a lot.
[0:41:19 – 0:41:20] Erik: Yeah.
[0:41:21 – 0:41:22] Erik: This one I definitely have a comment on.
[0:41:22 – 0:41:25] Erik: The cans and bottles I feel like is a little antiquated.
[0:41:25 – 0:41:26] Erik: Yes.
[0:41:26 – 0:41:27] Erik: No glass.
[0:41:27 – 0:41:30] Adam: Yeah, you can’t break an aluminum can.
[0:41:30 – 0:41:39] Erik: You can’t break an aluminum can, though, and my thinking on the no cans or bottles is, all right, so you break a glass bottle.
[0:41:39 – 0:41:42] Erik: Yeah, that’s pretty terrible to have out in the woods.
[0:41:42 – 0:41:42] Erik: Yeah, we don’t want that.
[0:41:43 – 0:41:51] Erik: But what is the difference between a can and a plastic bag, which is a Ziploc is allowed.
[0:41:51 – 0:41:51] Erik: Yeah.
[0:41:51 – 0:41:53] Erik: An aluminum can is not.
[0:41:53 – 0:41:55] Erik: It all boils down to pack it in, pack it out.
[0:41:55 – 0:41:59] Adam: You could bring a two liter, big old two liter Mountain Dew out there.
[0:42:00 – 0:42:00] Erik: Yeah.
[0:42:00 – 0:42:03] Erik: Why aren’t car tires not allowed?
[0:42:03 – 0:42:07] Erik: I could haul in a tire if I wanted, but I still have to pack it out.
[0:42:07 – 0:42:08] Erik: Leave no trace.
[0:42:08 – 0:42:10] Adam: Yeah, Leave No Trace says it all.
[0:42:10 – 0:42:11] Adam: I don’t get the no cans thing at all.
[0:42:11 – 0:42:16] Erik: I think the can thing is a carryover from, like, the 70s when everything was in cans.
[0:42:17 – 0:42:18] Adam: Yeah, they’d pitch their can in the lake.
[0:42:19 – 0:42:19] Erik: Yeah.
[0:42:20 – 0:42:23] Adam: Because you see that, like, I’ve done the Namakagan River in northwest Wisconsin.
[0:42:24 – 0:42:31] Adam: And to this day, you’ll still see, you’ll just be paddling along and there’s an old, like, bush light can when they were still made out of tin.
[0:42:32 – 0:42:33] Erik: The two holes on the top.
[0:42:33 – 0:42:33] Erik: Yeah.
[0:42:33 – 0:42:33] Erik: Yeah.
[0:42:34 – 0:42:38] Adam: Yeah, like you had to literally hit it with a hammer on the top to open those things.
[0:42:38 – 0:42:41] Adam: You just see one of those lodged into the bottom of the river.
[0:42:41 – 0:42:48] Adam: It’s like, yeah, no matter how many times you stop and pull those things out, the current shift and then a new can is exposed.
[0:42:49 – 0:42:50] Adam: People like to litter their cans.
[0:42:50 – 0:42:51] Adam: I think times have changed now.
[0:42:51 – 0:42:54] Adam: People realize you can’t just pitch some things in the lake.
[0:42:54 – 0:42:54] Erik: Right.
[0:42:55 – 0:43:00] Adam: But that’s, I guess, why it’s like, oh, you will end up with more litter if you allow it.
[0:43:01 – 0:43:03] Erik: Yeah, it’s probably one of those things where it’s established.
[0:43:03 – 0:43:05] Erik: You probably shouldn’t go back on it.
[0:43:05 – 0:43:08] Erik: But at the same time, there are so many- People who litter anything.
[0:43:08 – 0:43:14] Erik: Well, yeah, there is so much more litter out there that why don’t you ban plastic bags?
[0:43:14 – 0:43:14] Erik: Candy bars.
[0:43:14 – 0:43:16] Erik: Why don’t you ban zip ties?
[0:43:17 – 0:43:19] Erik: Why don’t you ban twist ties or cigarette butts?
[0:43:19 – 0:43:21] Erik: All those little things that you see.
[0:43:21 – 0:43:27] Erik: I guess cans are bigger, but really what they should be emphasizing is just a general leave no trace approach.
[0:43:27 – 0:43:28] Adam: You can have cigarettes, right?
[0:43:28 – 0:43:29] Adam: Yeah.
[0:43:29 – 0:43:30] Erik: Could you imagine the Boundary Waters?
[0:43:30 – 0:43:34] Adam: You can have cigarettes, but not a can of beer or a can of pop or whatever.
[0:43:35 – 0:43:36] Erik: What do you think the…
[0:43:36 – 0:43:37] Erik: Seems silly.
[0:43:37 – 0:43:43] Erik: The Boundary Waters sees about 250,000 to 300,000 visitors a year.
[0:43:43 – 0:43:48] Erik: Do you think that number would go down significantly if it was no cigarettes allowed?
[0:43:49 – 0:44:13] Adam: maybe maybe probably nobody would that would be a serious infringement on yeah you go ahead and try and turn it out you know i’m sure there’s still people bringing cans of beer too yeah thought this was america yeah was this soviet russia yeah i yeah i don’t know i mean it’s not that big of a deal but it’s just why specifically cans yeah well you know i think it is it was like an old thing where people used to litter them up like crazy and yeah i don’t know
[0:44:14 – 0:44:18] Erik: Plastic bags, they probably fly away easier in the breeze, you know?
[0:44:18 – 0:44:18] Adam: Yeah.
[0:44:19 – 0:44:23] Adam: Hell, I’ve had almost a whole tent bag blow in the lake on me a few different times.
[0:44:23 – 0:44:25] Adam: I’ve lost a sleeping bag to the lake.
[0:44:26 – 0:44:27] Adam: Recovered, but still.
[0:44:28 – 0:44:28] Adam: Point of order.
[0:44:29 – 0:44:30] Erik: Point of law.
[0:44:31 – 0:44:35] Erik: Yeah, so food leftovers, yeah, I mean, pack it out.
[0:44:36 – 0:44:37] Erik: Don’t try to burn that stuff.
[0:44:38 – 0:44:40] Erik: Not really much of a comment on their live bait.
[0:44:42 – 0:44:46] Erik: They recommend that those live baits are being purchased in the area.
[0:44:46 – 0:44:48] Erik: This is a big one more recently.
[0:44:48 – 0:44:49] Erik: Yeah.
[0:44:49 – 0:44:52] Erik: And not just thrown in the lake when you’re done with it.
[0:44:52 – 0:44:54] Erik: You should definitely be packing that out as well.
[0:44:56 – 0:45:00] Erik: The fish remains, though, that’s something that seems like it changes almost every few years.
[0:45:01 – 0:45:09] Erik: At this point, it is carry the fish remains back into the woods well away from camp and dispose of it on the ground.
[0:45:11 – 0:45:14] Erik: Used to be dig a hole and bury it.
[0:45:14 – 0:45:15] Erik: Used to be just throw it in a lake.
[0:45:15 – 0:45:16] Erik: Yeah.
[0:45:16 – 0:45:26] Erik: And I don’t know, like apparently the science or the researchers at the USDA have deemed that that is a constantly changing need.
[0:45:27 – 0:45:34] Erik: But I mean, I understand like don’t dump fish guts and skins like right in front of camp.
[0:45:34 – 0:45:36] Adam: Or, like, in the dumper.
[0:45:36 – 0:45:38] Erik: Yeah, or definitely not in the dumper.
[0:45:40 – 0:45:40] Erik: I don’t know.
[0:45:40 – 0:45:46] Erik: I’ve kind of always, like, I’ve always been, like, yeah, just throw it out on shore, like, away from camp across the lake.
[0:45:47 – 0:45:47] Erik: Yeah.
[0:45:47 – 0:45:48] Erik: Some birds will find it.
[0:45:49 – 0:45:57] Erik: I don’t know why, like, throwing it just on the ground behind camp, it seems like it’s just leading to people just, because I’ve seen that.
[0:45:58 – 0:45:59] Adam: Yeah, I’ve found, you know.
[0:46:00 – 0:46:01] Erik: They don’t go far enough away.
[0:46:01 – 0:46:03] Adam: No, I’ve found so many fish heads.
[0:46:03 – 0:46:05] Erik: Fish guts, just on the way back to the latrine.
[0:46:05 – 0:46:07] Adam: Yeah, there’s an old pike.
[0:46:07 – 0:46:08] Erik: Yeah, that’s gross.
[0:46:09 – 0:46:09] Erik: Thanks.
[0:46:10 – 0:46:10] Erik: I don’t know.
[0:46:11 – 0:46:12] Erik: I don’t know if there is a good answer for that one.
[0:46:13 – 0:46:13] Adam: I don’t know.
[0:46:13 – 0:46:15] Adam: That’s a trace you just got to deal with.
[0:46:16 – 0:46:16] Erik: Yeah.
[0:46:16 – 0:46:17] Adam: Deal with it.
[0:46:17 – 0:46:18] Adam: Put it somewhere where nobody’s ever going to find it.
[0:46:19 – 0:46:19] Adam: How about that?
[0:46:19 – 0:46:23] Erik: Yeah, there you go, which is probably never going to happen.
[0:46:23 – 0:46:24] Erik: Pack it out.
[0:46:25 – 0:46:26] Erik: Haul out those fish guts.
[0:46:26 – 0:46:28] Erik: Yeah.
[0:46:28 – 0:46:28] Erik: Yeah.
[0:46:28 – 0:46:30] Erik: Can I burn my trash or throw it in latrine?
[0:46:30 – 0:46:31] Erik: No.
[0:46:31 – 0:46:31] Erik: No.
[0:46:32 – 0:46:33] Erik: Enough said.
[0:46:35 – 0:46:38] Erik: Washing yourself and your dishes in the lake.
[0:46:39 – 0:46:41] Erik: The biggest one for that for me, I don’t think I would change it.
[0:46:41 – 0:46:42] Erik: I don’t think I would change that.
[0:46:42 – 0:46:49] Erik: But yeah, like it’s amazing how many camps that you go to during the season where it’s just like you can tell what somebody had the night before.
[0:46:50 – 0:46:58] Erik: Like I’m all right with like rinsing a couple of things here or there, but like huge like piles of food in the lake.
[0:46:58 – 0:47:00] Erik: I mean, that’s just generally gross.
[0:47:00 – 0:47:01] Erik: Yeah.
[0:47:01 – 0:47:06] Adam: Just leave it in your trough and then mix your coffee with it the next morning.
[0:47:06 – 0:47:08] Adam: That’s the best way to get rid of your leftover dinner.
[0:47:09 – 0:47:10] Erik: Added bonus to the camper trough.
[0:47:11 – 0:47:12] Erik: Pack it in, pack it out.
[0:47:12 – 0:47:13] Erik: Never have to wash it.
[0:47:13 – 0:47:14] Erik: And it has a lid.
[0:47:16 – 0:47:18] Erik: A quiet camper is a no-trace camper, of course.
[0:47:19 – 0:47:29] Erik: The only thing that this reminds me of is a story I heard about somebody who was very bothered by a trombonist.
[0:47:29 – 0:47:51] Erik: across the lake wow i always remember that whenever i see the quiet camper is a leave no trace camper and i think about the time that i heard of somebody who was bothered by i mean who’s hauling out a trombone somebody who’s very passionate about the trombone somebody who is very passionate yeah gotta practice can’t skip practice not even for one day if i’m gonna make the first chair yep
[0:47:53 – 0:47:54] Erik: So, yeah, I wouldn’t change that at all.
[0:47:54 – 0:47:58] Erik: Maybe I would even add to it specifically no trombones.
[0:47:58 – 0:47:59] Adam: No bagpipes either.
[0:47:59 – 0:48:00] Erik: No bagpipes.
[0:48:00 – 0:48:04] Erik: At the most, a recorder with a silencer on the end.
[0:48:06 – 0:48:08] Erik: Hot cross buns only.
[0:48:09 – 0:48:11] Erik: Motorized equipment allowed in the BWCA, question mark?
[0:48:12 – 0:48:13] Erik: Right?
[0:48:13 – 0:48:13] Erik: That’s the point.
[0:48:14 – 0:48:15] Erik: That it’s not.
[0:48:15 – 0:48:19] Erik: Except in specific areas, there’s a hot button issue too.
[0:48:19 – 0:48:19] Erik: What?
[0:48:19 – 0:48:20] Erik: I imagine.
[0:48:20 – 0:48:21] Erik: The lakes that allow motors.
[0:48:21 – 0:48:22] Erik: Oh, whatever.
[0:48:22 – 0:48:23] Erik: Cooperations.
[0:48:23 – 0:48:23] Erik: Border lakes.
[0:48:23 – 0:48:23] Erik: Yes.
[0:48:26 – 0:48:41] Erik: Not that it’s specific to motorization, but one of the things that I always notice whenever I’m in some specific areas where you see the sign for you are now entering the wilderness and it gives you the list of things that aren’t allowed.
[0:48:41 – 0:48:42] Erik: Yeah.
[0:48:42 – 0:48:43] Erik: Yeah, motorized equipment.
[0:48:43 – 0:48:44] Erik: Hang gliders.
[0:48:44 – 0:48:47] Erik: Yes, and that’s always the most hilarious thing.
[0:48:47 – 0:48:47] Erik: Sorry, did I jump the gun on that one?
[0:48:48 – 0:48:49] Erik: Yeah, you jumped right to hang gliders.
[0:48:50 – 0:48:51] Erik: No, it’s not a problem.
[0:48:51 – 0:48:51] Erik: Wheels.
[0:48:52 – 0:48:55] Erik: Yeah, it gives a list, but then it ends with hang gliders.
[0:48:56 – 0:48:59] Erik: I mean, there are about a thousand things in between hang gliders.
[0:48:59 – 0:49:02] Adam: They need to have drones, not hang gliders at this point.
[0:49:02 – 0:49:06] Adam: Yeah, I think that’s… How many people have drones nowadays and how many people have a hang glider?
[0:49:07 – 0:49:15] Erik: Well, you know, this probably, we can say that the, I know the U.S. Forest Service is working on a new video.
[0:49:15 – 0:49:16] Erik: I don’t even know.
[0:49:16 – 0:49:17] Erik: Maybe we mentioned that last week.
[0:49:17 – 0:49:18] Adam: No, we did.
[0:49:18 – 0:49:18] Adam: Yeah.
[0:49:18 – 0:49:21] Adam: I mean, that was kind of the whole impetus to get to this episode now.
[0:49:21 – 0:49:26] Erik: And I’m pretty sure drones is going to be like one of the biggest differences and hammocks.
[0:49:26 – 0:49:35] Erik: and how people are cutting down branches to make room for hammocks, and how those have been some of the bigger changes, and just to update the general feel.
[0:49:35 – 0:49:40] Adam: Do you think anybody’s ever taken a hang glider off the Palisades on Clearwater?
[0:49:41 – 0:49:43] Adam: It’d be a really great spot to launch a hang glider.
[0:49:43 – 0:49:44] Adam: Fact check us.
[0:49:44 – 0:49:50] Adam: It’s in the Boundary Waters, so I don’t know where you’d land, but you could definitely take off.
[0:49:50 – 0:49:53] Erik: Yeah, we’ve got buttless chaps and tump lines for pies.
[0:49:54 – 0:49:57] Adam: Maybe next season we’ll have to capsize a hang glider.
[0:49:57 – 0:49:59] Adam: Capsize a hang glider.
[0:49:59 – 0:50:00] Adam: See how that goes.
[0:50:00 – 0:50:07] Erik: Well, they’re not technically allowed on the Palisades, so let’s write into the USDA to get that hang glider rule changed.
[0:50:08 – 0:50:09] Erik: Um, no sails either.
[0:50:10 – 0:50:14] Erik: Although I think if you can fashion one from your camp equipment, they’re allowed.
[0:50:15 – 0:50:16] Erik: Cause that’s, I mean, we’ve done that.
[0:50:17 – 0:50:24] Adam: We’ve run sailboats like proper, but yeah, if you like hold up a couple of paddles with a tarp tied between them, that’s cool.
[0:50:25 – 0:50:26] Erik: Yeah, exactly.
[0:50:26 – 0:50:33] Erik: And no pontoon boats, which even, like, regardless of the horsepower, you can’t have pontoon boats.
[0:50:34 – 0:50:34] Erik: Oh.
[0:50:34 – 0:50:37] Erik: Which, I don’t know why, it’s kind of like the cans.
[0:50:37 – 0:50:40] Erik: It’s like, well, why?
[0:50:40 – 0:50:43] Adam: Somebody had a bad experience on a pontoon.
[0:50:43 – 0:50:47] Erik: So, like, you couldn’t take, you know, those little electric, like, tiny pontoons, the mighty tune.
[0:50:47 – 0:50:48] Adam: Yeah.
[0:50:49 – 0:50:51] Adam: What about tying two canoes together and then hanging out?
[0:50:52 – 0:50:54] Erik: Yeah, that kind of turns it into a pontoon.
[0:50:54 – 0:50:54] Erik: It sure does.
[0:50:55 – 0:50:55] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[0:50:56 – 0:50:56] Erik: I don’t know.
[0:50:56 – 0:51:14] Erik: An electric motor on a mighty tune is way less aggressive or noticeable than somebody’s old Mercury from 1965 that happens to be an eight horsepower motor just chugging down the lake going a mile and a half an hour.
[0:51:14 – 0:51:16] Erik: What’s the big deal with pontoons?
[0:51:17 – 0:51:20] Erik: I get if it’s like a huge pontoon, but… Yeah, a party barge.
[0:51:20 – 0:51:22] Erik: The shape of the boat shouldn’t matter.
[0:51:22 – 0:51:23] Adam: No, it shouldn’t.
[0:51:24 – 0:51:27] Adam: But then again, I don’t know.
[0:51:27 – 0:51:27] Adam: Yeah.
[0:51:28 – 0:51:28] Adam: Goofy.
[0:51:28 – 0:51:29] Adam: It’s just goofy.
[0:51:29 – 0:51:30] Erik: It’s just goofy.
[0:51:30 – 0:51:32] Erik: Some of these things are goofy.
[0:51:32 – 0:51:33] Erik: Dogs.
[0:51:33 – 0:51:38] Erik: I wouldn’t really change much with dogs, except for maybe the barking of them.
[0:51:38 – 0:51:39] Erik: But that’s personal.
[0:51:40 – 0:51:40] Erik: Yeah.
[0:51:40 – 0:51:42] Adam: Let’s train your dog better.
[0:51:42 – 0:51:43] Adam: Don’t have a barking dog.
[0:51:43 – 0:51:43] Erik: Yeah.
[0:51:43 – 0:51:44] Erik: Pick up after him.
[0:51:44 – 0:51:45] Erik: Come on.
[0:51:45 – 0:51:47] Erik: Firearms, fireworks.
[0:51:47 – 0:51:48] Erik: Obviously, fireworks are not allowed.
[0:51:50 – 0:51:52] Adam: We did hear some fireworks on Brule.
[0:51:53 – 0:51:53] Adam: Oh, that’s right.
[0:51:53 – 0:52:02] Adam: We still never determined if they were on Brule somewhere up in the Cone Bay or if we were hearing some sort of weird sound audio.
[0:52:03 – 0:52:03] Adam: What do you call that?
[0:52:04 – 0:52:05] Erik: An echo?
[0:52:06 – 0:52:09] Adam: It’s not an echo, but, yeah, it’s sort of like an echo.
[0:52:09 – 0:52:09] Erik: Yeah.
[0:52:09 – 0:52:11] Erik: No, I get what you’re saying, but I don’t know.
[0:52:11 – 0:52:12] Adam: I feel like they were still probably.
[0:52:12 – 0:52:13] Adam: It’s an acoustic shadow.
[0:52:13 – 0:52:14] Erik: Ooh, wow.
[0:52:15 – 0:52:17] Erik: The Acoustic Shadow, episode 27.
[0:52:17 – 0:52:19] Erik: Love it.
[0:52:19 – 0:52:24] Erik: Yeah, I don’t know if, I still feel like that was probably just coming from like Poplar Lake.
[0:52:24 – 0:52:25] Erik: It was coming straight from the north.
[0:52:26 – 0:52:27] Adam: Yeah, but why?
[0:52:27 – 0:52:28] Adam: It wasn’t even dark.
[0:52:28 – 0:52:29] Adam: No, yeah, it was not.
[0:52:29 – 0:52:31] Erik: It was way too early for fireworks.
[0:52:31 – 0:52:34] Erik: Or somebody was just up on a winchel just blowing off some mortars.
[0:52:34 – 0:52:37] Adam: Yeah, somebody was doing something probably illegal there.
[0:52:37 – 0:52:39] Erik: Yeah.
[0:52:39 – 0:52:41] Erik: Firearms, this is a personal thing.
[0:52:41 – 0:52:48] Erik: Like, I don’t think firearms are really necessary to have out there at all, especially considering the specific requirements to be able to use it.
[0:52:49 – 0:52:53] Erik: I mean, 150 yards from Water’s Edge campsites or portages…
[0:52:54 – 0:52:59] Erik: Pretty much limits you to basically the middle of the woods.
[0:53:01 – 0:53:03] Erik: There’s no longer a moose season.
[0:53:03 – 0:53:07] Erik: There’s not really much duck hunting.
[0:53:08 – 0:53:11] Erik: And deer hunting in the Bajau waters is probably, maybe on the west side.
[0:53:12 – 0:53:12] Erik: Maybe.
[0:53:12 – 0:53:13] Erik: Okay.
[0:53:14 – 0:53:19] Erik: The only thing that I could really see using guns for in the Bajau waters would be some grouse hunting.
[0:53:20 – 0:53:21] Adam: What about rabbits?
[0:53:22 – 0:53:23] Erik: Maybe rabbits, but yeah.
[0:53:24 – 0:53:28] Adam: If you want to eat a greasy old rabbit.
[0:53:28 – 0:53:28] Erik: Yeah.
[0:53:29 – 0:53:31] Erik: So, yeah, I mean, I don’t know.
[0:53:31 – 0:53:32] Erik: That’s just a personal thing.
[0:53:32 – 0:53:37] Erik: I don’t think, it’s like, I think the way that Quetico is run with firearms is a little bit better just personally.
[0:53:38 – 0:54:01] Erik: none at all yeah and i think barbless hooks is probably a good way to go too for me i i crimp all my hooks already because it’s just less of a pain to unhook a fish in a canoe but um that’s the the main list that comes on the back of the permit i’m sure our uh fellow listeners and paddlers have a few things to say
[0:54:02 – 0:54:05] Adam: Yeah, I mean, I’m just by nature not much of a stickler.
[0:54:05 – 0:54:06] Erik: Yeah.
[0:54:06 – 0:54:15] Adam: So, you know, I try my best to follow the rules, but this is really the first time I’ve kind of combed through the back of the permit in a while.
[0:54:15 – 0:54:16] Adam: It’s been enlightening.
[0:54:17 – 0:54:18] Erik: Yeah.
[0:54:18 – 0:54:20] Adam: I’m not sure if it was enlightening.
[0:54:20 – 0:54:21] Adam: That might be too strong.
[0:54:21 – 0:54:22] Adam: But it was interesting.
[0:54:22 – 0:54:23] Erik: I’ve been enlightened.
[0:54:24 – 0:54:28] Erik: Well, I have to pee like a racehorse.
[0:54:28 – 0:54:31] Erik: So maybe we’ll come back.
[0:54:31 – 0:54:31] Erik: Maybe we won’t.
[0:54:31 – 0:54:38] Erik: But most likely we’re going to finish with our personal thoughts on this and come back with your thoughts on the matter.
[0:54:39 – 0:54:39] Erik: How’s that sound?
[0:54:39 – 0:54:40] Adam: Good.
[0:54:42 – 0:54:42] Adam: Good.
[0:54:42 – 0:54:43] Adam: Yes.
[0:54:44 – 0:54:44] Adam: Let’s.
[0:54:45 – 0:54:45] Erik: All right.
[0:54:45 – 0:54:46] Erik: Here we go.
[0:54:48 – 0:54:48] Erik: All right.
[0:54:49 – 0:54:50] Erik: We’re back.
[0:54:51 – 0:54:51] Erik: Are we back?
[0:54:52 – 0:54:52] Adam: Yeah, how was that?
[0:54:53 – 0:54:53] Adam: So you peed.
[0:54:54 – 0:54:55] Adam: It’s three days later.
[0:54:55 – 0:54:57] Adam: Yeah, it was a good pee.
[0:54:57 – 0:54:58] Adam: Yeah, pretty solid.
[0:54:59 – 0:55:05] Adam: I’ve gotten a lot done in the last three days, actually, but I’m ready to continue this episode of Tumble Home.
[0:55:06 – 0:55:13] Adam: And we were talking about rule changes and generally the rules.
[0:55:13 – 0:55:13] Adam: Yes.
[0:55:14 – 0:55:21] Adam: So we had a lot of good responses on social media from our good friends at BWCA Reddit.
[0:55:23 – 0:55:24] Adam: And so shall we start there?
[0:55:24 – 0:55:25] Adam: Let’s start there.
[0:55:25 – 0:55:30] Erik: Hashtag printed reddit.
[0:55:30 – 0:55:31] Erik: We’ll switch off?
[0:55:32 – 0:55:32] Erik: Yes.
[0:55:36 – 0:55:37] Erik: Thrust-o-bot.
[0:55:39 – 0:55:40] Erik: Nice.
[0:55:41 – 0:55:41] Erik: 10 points.
[0:55:42 – 0:55:43] Erik: I would like to see… Wow, 10 points.
[0:55:43 – 0:55:46] Erik: Yeah, I think that might be the max we’ve ever had.
[0:55:46 – 0:55:47] Erik: Double digits.
[0:55:48 – 0:55:48] Erik: Double didge.
[0:55:49 – 0:55:52] Erik: I would like to see it go to barbless hooks.
[0:55:52 – 0:55:59] Erik: I don’t think it makes that much of a difference, and it greatly reduces our impact on fish mortality rates.
[0:56:00 – 0:56:01] Erik: Yeah, I agree.
[0:56:02 – 0:56:11] Erik: I definitely, at the very least, I crimp, especially the Rapalas that have the two treble hooks, I usually crimp one of those down.
[0:56:12 – 0:56:13] Erik: It’s just such a mess.
[0:56:13 – 0:56:24] Erik: You get a fish on, and you’re hooked in one place, and then it’ll thrash, and it’ll hook in its neck somewhere, and it’s all just the barbed hooks.
[0:56:24 – 0:56:26] Erik: You’re like, jeez, these are impossible to pull out.
[0:56:26 – 0:56:27] Adam: You ever hook yourself?
[0:56:28 – 0:56:34] Erik: Yeah, I’ve not done it bad enough that I have had to go to the fish hook removal center in Grand Marais.
[0:56:34 – 0:56:36] Adam: Oh, that’s a fine fish hook removal center.
[0:56:37 – 0:56:40] Adam: They don’t accept most insurance, but they will rip those hooks out.
[0:56:42 – 0:56:45] Adam: Yeah, I’ve had a few big ones get in there.
[0:56:45 – 0:56:46] Adam: Whoppers?
[0:56:46 – 0:56:48] Adam: I had one right through the thumb one time.
[0:56:48 – 0:56:50] Adam: I had one stuck in my face.
[0:56:51 – 0:57:14] Adam: trying to net a big northern and shook it free and just right into the face jeez yeah i hooked my mom in the nose when i was a kid yikes yeah a bit of a history of the hooks we should have a whole episode on crazy hook stories because i’ve seen family stories i’ve seen one where like somebody’s gotten hooked like through the nail
[0:57:16 – 0:57:24] Erik: It’s not one of those things, you know, there’s always those first aid, like, well, you push down and wrap it in fishing line and yank quickly.
[0:57:24 – 0:57:28] Erik: I don’t think that method works if it goes through a nail.
[0:57:29 – 0:57:30] Erik: Jeez.
[0:57:30 – 0:57:34] Erik: Yeah, and then there’s also the push it back through and then crimp the barb.
[0:57:34 – 0:57:47] Erik: That’s way easier said than done because I sat at a kitchen table one time with somebody who ended up getting kind of inebriated on tequila trying to push the hook through his finger.
[0:57:47 – 0:57:48] Adam: Oh, boy.
[0:57:48 – 0:57:48] Adam: Yeah.
[0:57:49 – 0:57:55] Adam: So we won’t dwell on the hook scenario, but we’ll let you take a… More than that.
[0:57:55 – 0:57:56] Adam: Yeah.
[0:57:56 – 0:57:57] Adam: Let there be light.
[0:58:00 – 0:58:02] Adam: Paints with smegma.
[0:58:02 – 0:58:02] Adam: 7 points.
[0:58:03 – 0:58:09] Adam: Eh, I’m pretty cool with the current status, but if I was reaching, I’d like to see garbage bags a mandatory piece of gear.
[0:58:09 – 0:58:15] Adam: I end up packing out a lot of tinfoil and shredded tarps, but I don’t want that banned because most people use it correctly.
[0:58:16 – 0:58:19] Adam: However, I’ve been with a bunch of people who don’t bring a trash bag.
[0:58:19 – 0:58:20] Adam: Issue them with the permit.
[0:58:21 – 0:58:22] Adam: Yeah.
[0:58:23 – 0:58:26] Adam: Remember in Canyonlands, they issued us like a bag to poop in?
[0:58:26 – 0:58:28] Erik: The poop bag.
[0:58:28 – 0:58:29] Adam: You had to take the poop bag.
[0:58:30 – 0:58:44] Erik: If you remember, listeners, anybody who visited the park, I think maybe five, at least before five years ago, they used to issue garbage bags.
[0:58:45 – 0:58:45] Adam: Oh, really?
[0:58:46 – 0:58:46] Adam: I didn’t remember that.
[0:58:46 – 0:58:47] Adam: Yeah.
[0:58:47 – 0:58:48] Erik: Cooperators had them.
[0:58:49 – 0:58:53] Erik: The U.S. Forest Service ranger stations had them, and they had a little cinch top.
[0:58:54 – 0:58:59] Erik: It was just a basic garbage bag, but it had the parameters for the bear hang on the side of them.
[0:58:59 – 0:58:59] Adam: Oh, yeah.
[0:59:00 – 0:59:07] Erik: And, you know, we’ll get to this later, but I think the funding for that ran out, so they don’t send out the bags anymore.
[0:59:07 – 0:59:08] Erik: That and many other things.
[0:59:08 – 0:59:08] Erik: Yeah.
[0:59:08 – 0:59:09] Erik: Yeah.
[0:59:10 – 0:59:25] Erik: But yeah, I, you know, that would be nice, but it’s still, I don’t think would necessarily get rid of the fact that people don’t do a scan of their camp after they leave to pick up the little, you know, the micro litter as it were.
[0:59:26 – 0:59:36] Erik: Garbage bag or not, you know, it’s like we were talking about previously, you know, cans or plastic bags, pack it in, pack it out.
[0:59:36 – 0:59:37] Erik: It doesn’t necessarily matter what it is.
[0:59:37 – 0:59:41] Erik: So even if you have a garbage bag, people are going to be probably still forgetting stuff.
[0:59:41 – 0:59:45] Erik: And that’s just, I don’t know if we can ever get away from that.
[0:59:46 – 0:59:47] Adam: Leroy218.
[0:59:48 – 0:59:48] Adam: Hello.
[0:59:48 – 0:59:50] Adam: Thanks, Leroy.
[0:59:51 – 0:59:51] Adam: Six points.
[0:59:52 – 0:59:52] Erik: Six points.
[0:59:54 – 0:59:58] Erik: Drop a bunch of the popular entry point quotas by half.
[0:59:59 – 0:59:59] Adam: Half?
[0:59:59 – 1:00:01] Adam: Like, make them less.
[1:00:01 – 1:00:01] Erik: Yeah.
[1:00:02 – 1:00:03] Erik: I think that’s what half means.
[1:00:04 – 1:00:04] Adam: By half.
[1:00:05 – 1:00:06] Erik: By one half.
[1:00:07 – 1:00:07] Adam: Okay.
[1:00:07 – 1:00:09] Erik: And no live bait.
[1:00:10 – 1:00:12] Erik: Help limit invasive species introduction.
[1:00:13 – 1:00:17] Erik: Yeah, we’re getting a couple of Quetico regulations coming in.
[1:00:17 – 1:00:18] Erik: Barbless.
[1:00:18 – 1:00:19] Erik: No live bait.
[1:00:20 – 1:00:22] Erik: Yeah, the popular entry point quotas thing.
[1:00:23 – 1:00:24] Erik: I think that’s…
[1:00:25 – 1:00:27] Erik: I think generally I agree with that.
[1:00:27 – 1:00:29] Erik: But the…
[1:00:31 – 1:00:57] Erik: the logistics of how that would look and what that would actually be you know you might just end up seeing that those half carry over into other entry permits so I think like we’ve also said so far it I think it’s being managed as well as it can be but yeah I get some of those more popular ones they definitely do get a little crowded in the summer
[1:00:58 – 1:01:21] Adam: blow zephyr five points i decree that thank you first of all for decreeing somebody’s got the proper language going on here i decree that all complaining shall hereby be banned in the boundary waters canoe area wilderness quit complaining no crying is there’s no crying in the boundary waters
[1:01:21 – 1:01:26] Erik: Is it that complaining should be banned or anybody that complains?
[1:01:26 – 1:01:27] Erik: No, just no complaining.
[1:01:27 – 1:01:28] Erik: Just complaining?
[1:01:28 – 1:01:28] Erik: Nice.
[1:01:28 – 1:01:29] Adam: No whining.
[1:01:30 – 1:01:30] Adam: No whining.
[1:01:30 – 1:01:32] Adam: No complaining in camp.
[1:01:33 – 1:01:33] Erik: Yeah.
[1:01:33 – 1:01:34] Erik: Add that rule.
[1:01:34 – 1:01:36] Adam: Do it.
[1:01:36 – 1:01:37] Adam: What about on portages, though?
[1:01:38 – 1:01:40] Adam: You should be allowed to complain a little bit.
[1:01:40 – 1:01:44] Adam: You get like one or two complaints a day while on portage, but not in camp.
[1:01:44 – 1:01:44] Adam: Yeah, right.
[1:01:45 – 1:01:45] Adam: Exactly.
[1:01:45 – 1:01:47] Erik: Don’t complain in camp.
[1:01:47 – 1:01:48] Erik: No excessive complaining.
[1:01:49 – 1:01:49] Adam: Yeah.
[1:01:49 – 1:01:50] Adam: All right.
[1:01:50 – 1:01:50] Adam: I’m on board.
[1:01:51 – 1:01:51] Erik: I’m for it.
[1:01:52 – 1:01:52] Erik: We’re for it.
[1:01:54 – 1:01:57] Adam: I don’t know if that was just on the back of the permit.
[1:01:58 – 1:01:59] Erik: Final rule.
[1:02:00 – 1:02:00] Erik: No whining.
[1:02:00 – 1:02:02] Erik: No complaining.
[1:02:03 – 1:02:04] Erik: I’m laughing at the…
[1:02:05 – 1:02:06] Erik: I love that…
[1:02:07 – 1:02:08] Erik: I’m just reading these for the first time.
[1:02:08 – 1:02:11] Erik: Yeah, no, I kept myself in the dark on this.
[1:02:11 – 1:02:18] Erik: Which is good and bad, but this is good for having read this for this time because I got a legitimate chuckle out of it.
[1:02:20 – 1:02:26] Erik: From you, because of the internet, I would like a few Chipotles scattered around.
[1:02:26 – 1:02:29] Erik: All right.
[1:02:30 – 1:02:31] Erik: Just scattered.
[1:02:31 – 1:02:32] Erik: A couple scattered.
[1:02:32 – 1:02:35] Adam: Next week, where would you like the Chipotles?
[1:02:35 – 1:02:36] Adam: Yeah, you never know.
[1:02:36 – 1:02:38] Adam: You’d have to check your Marauders map.
[1:02:38 – 1:02:39] Adam: Oh, yes.
[1:02:40 – 1:02:41] Adam: where they move around.
[1:02:41 – 1:02:44] Adam: The Chipotles, they’re static.
[1:02:44 – 1:02:45] Adam: They’re not static.
[1:02:46 – 1:02:47] Adam: They’re dynamic Chipotles.
[1:02:47 – 1:02:48] Adam: Floating.
[1:02:48 – 1:02:49] Adam: Yeah, floating Chipotles.
[1:02:50 – 1:03:01] Adam: That’s how you get around the regs on that one, as long as you have a little Chipotles Express in a Seneca just barging around out there.
[1:03:01 – 1:03:05] Erik: And it’s a leading candidate for episode title of the week, Floating Chipotles.
[1:03:08 – 1:03:09] Adam: All right.
[1:03:09 – 1:03:11] Adam: Rybread26 got two points.
[1:03:12 – 1:03:14] Adam: I don’t know if it would change anything.
[1:03:15 – 1:03:17] Adam: I think I like it the way it is now.
[1:03:18 – 1:03:20] Adam: You know, that was like 10 words.
[1:03:20 – 1:03:22] Adam: I messed it up, but you got the gist of it.
[1:03:23 – 1:03:23] Adam: Don’t change anything.
[1:03:23 – 1:03:24] Adam: It’s great.
[1:03:25 – 1:03:25] Erik: All right.
[1:03:25 – 1:03:26] Adam: Fair enough.
[1:03:26 – 1:03:31] Adam: I would interject right here that I was asking Natalie about this before I came out to record tonight.
[1:03:31 – 1:03:33] Adam: I said, what would you change?
[1:03:33 – 1:03:33] Adam: And she goes…
[1:03:35 – 1:03:59] Adam: uh you know guides are allowed if you need a guide you shouldn’t be out there interesting so that’s not on the reddit or the facebook that was just a oral uh you know history yeah i just you know interviewed her before i came over so i wanted to relay that before i pass the page here yeah no that’s uh yeah think about that i mean i think most people i think if they really
[1:04:00 – 1:04:06] Erik: If you really think about it and you really just go through an outfitter, you don’t really need a guide.
[1:04:06 – 1:04:09] Erik: Fishing guide, yes.
[1:04:09 – 1:04:16] Erik: But just camping guide, start out at a level that you feel comfortable with and work your way up.
[1:04:16 – 1:04:17] Erik: Right, right.
[1:04:18 – 1:04:19] Erik: Canoe, 2-1-2.
[1:04:19 – 1:04:19] Erik: Canoe.
[1:04:22 – 1:04:27] Erik: I would allow man-powered mechanical devices similar to the Hobie kayaks.
[1:04:28 – 1:04:29] Adam: Oh, yeah, those foot drives.
[1:04:29 – 1:04:29] Erik: Yeah.
[1:04:29 – 1:04:32] Erik: I think they’re already within the spirit of the law.
[1:04:32 – 1:04:34] Erik: A minor tweak and they would be illegal.
[1:04:34 – 1:04:35] Erik: Yeah.
[1:04:35 – 1:04:43] Erik: No, I mean, I’ve seen those on the edge of the parking places where it’s basically like a bicycle, like pedal kayak.
[1:04:43 – 1:04:46] Erik: And I think for especially some people that, you know,
[1:04:48 – 1:04:52] Erik: your shoulder goes bum, get a little bit older.
[1:04:53 – 1:04:56] Erik: So that might be the only way that you can get into the park.
[1:04:57 – 1:05:02] Erik: And I think it could very least be, be, it’s really funny.
[1:05:02 – 1:05:06] Erik: Like, so is it like that Hobie kayak, the peddling kayak?
[1:05:06 – 1:05:08] Erik: Is that allowed down the length of Clearwater?
[1:05:10 – 1:05:13] Erik: Because there’s 9.9 horsepower motors.
[1:05:14 – 1:05:17] Adam: Yeah, it would be pretty silly if it wasn’t allowed.
[1:05:17 – 1:05:17] Erik: Yeah.
[1:05:18 – 1:05:22] Erik: You can take your motorboat down the lake, but that pedal kayak, not allowed.
[1:05:22 – 1:05:23] Erik: I don’t know.
[1:05:23 – 1:05:33] Adam: Can you take a paddle boat, like the old traditional square paddle boat with the one person steering the joystick and a little riverboat action going on?
[1:05:33 – 1:05:34] Erik: Yeah, I don’t think so.
[1:05:34 – 1:05:37] Erik: And it’s also technically a pontoon, which is not allowed either.
[1:05:37 – 1:05:38] Adam: Plus it’s loud.
[1:05:40 – 1:05:43] Adam: 63 HZ V2.
[1:05:44 – 1:05:46] Adam: Is that sharp or something?
[1:05:46 – 1:05:46] Adam: Yeah.
[1:05:47 – 1:05:47] Adam: 63 megahertz.
[1:05:49 – 1:05:49] Adam: Two points.
[1:05:50 – 1:05:54] Adam: A strict no mining rule in perpetuity would be nice.
[1:05:56 – 1:05:56] Erik: Yeah.
[1:05:56 – 1:05:57] Adam: I love the podcast, fellas.
[1:05:58 – 1:05:58] Adam: Oh, boy.
[1:05:58 – 1:06:01] Adam: Am I supposed to read this part?
[1:06:02 – 1:06:02] Adam: We’re into it now.
[1:06:02 – 1:06:03] Erik: I’m blushing.
[1:06:04 – 1:06:04] Adam: Keep that up.
[1:06:04 – 1:06:06] Adam: It’s a great way to share ideas and learn new ones.
[1:06:30 – 1:06:31] Adam: That’s what it’s all about.
[1:06:32 – 1:06:42] Adam: I’d love to hear an episode about what makes a campsite great for you, both in terms of what you find at the campsite, what you bring along with you, what’s your campsite’s guilty pleasure.
[1:06:42 – 1:06:43] Adam: It’s camp slippers.
[1:06:44 – 1:06:44] Adam: Wine.
[1:06:45 – 1:06:45] Adam: And wine.
[1:06:46 – 1:06:48] Adam: What do you bring that adds the extra pizzazz?
[1:06:48 – 1:06:49] Adam: It’s party lights.
[1:06:50 – 1:06:50] Adam: Keep up the great work.
[1:06:50 – 1:06:51] Adam: Thank you.
[1:06:51 – 1:06:51] Erik: Nice.
[1:06:51 – 1:06:52] Erik: That was a fun one.
[1:06:53 – 1:07:01] Erik: I think we’ve touched on a little bit of all of that, but I do like the concept of a campsite guilty pleasure.
[1:07:01 – 1:07:02] Erik: Yeah.
[1:07:02 – 1:07:08] Erik: I think we’ve mentioned that a couple of times, like the camp slippers, the bag of wine.
[1:07:08 – 1:07:17] Erik: What jumps to my mind, at least in terms of the guilty pleasure for you, was the time that you guys hauled out that huge cooler, the Yeti.
[1:07:17 – 1:07:20] Erik: We brought the Yeti cooler all the way to Swan somehow.
[1:07:20 – 1:07:20] Adam: Yeah.
[1:07:21 – 1:07:23] Adam: We had to literally dump ice out at the end of that three day trip.
[1:07:23 – 1:07:24] Adam: Yeah.
[1:07:24 – 1:07:25] Adam: That’s how much ice we had.
[1:07:25 – 1:07:25] Erik: Yes.
[1:07:26 – 1:07:26] Adam: Kind of crazy.
[1:07:27 – 1:07:28] Adam: Yeah, no, that’s…
[1:07:28 – 1:07:30] Adam: Cold drinks, though, are nice on a hot summer day.
[1:07:31 – 1:07:32] Erik: We say it all the time.
[1:07:32 – 1:07:40] Erik: That’s part of the reason, if not the majority of the reason that we do it, to talk with other people, share ideas.
[1:07:40 – 1:07:43] Erik: Part of the reason that we like going out in the park is to see how other people do it.
[1:07:44 – 1:07:46] Erik: When we’re not out there, we like to talk about it.
[1:07:46 – 1:07:47] Erik: So that’s what we’re doing.
[1:07:48 – 1:07:52] Erik: Thank you, 638ZV2.
[1:07:52 – 1:07:53] Adam: Decipher.
[1:07:53 – 1:07:54] Adam: Yeah.
[1:07:54 – 1:07:54] Adam: Decipher.
[1:07:56 – 1:07:58] Erik: Fresh Coast underscore orca.
[1:07:59 – 1:08:01] Erik: Be nice to those orcas in the…
[1:08:01 – 1:08:04] Adam: I really wish you could see orcas in the Boundary Waters for sure.
[1:08:05 – 1:08:08] Erik: Don’t leave cigarette butts in the fire grate.
[1:08:08 – 1:08:09] Erik: Yeah.
[1:08:09 – 1:08:11] Erik: I mean, so many of these things are just like…
[1:08:11 – 1:08:12] Erik: It’s already a rule, though.
[1:08:12 – 1:08:13] Erik: Leave no trace.
[1:08:13 – 1:08:14] Erik: But yeah, it’s like, hey…
[1:08:15 – 1:08:39] Adam: make it more of a rule like seriously the cigarette butts we’ve talked about in the past that’s a huge the pet peeve episode if you leave a cigarette butt in the fire grade then it’ll like be reported on your Marauders map yes yeah if you leave a campsite but there’s litter then like the it changes from red to like a flashing light yeah and then you know the authorities are coming people know
[1:08:40 – 1:08:41] Adam: Maybe not authorities.
[1:08:41 – 1:08:46] Adam: There might not be enough authorities out there, but the rest of your fellow paddlers will know.
[1:08:48 – 1:08:48] Adam: All righty.
[1:08:49 – 1:08:50] Adam: Rave Dave.
[1:08:50 – 1:08:52] Adam: One point for Rave Dave.
[1:08:53 – 1:08:54] Adam: Rave Dave.
[1:08:55 – 1:08:56] Adam: What do you got to say?
[1:08:57 – 1:09:01] Adam: I wish there was a way to fix all the corners of packaging that comes off.
[1:09:02 – 1:09:04] Adam: There’s all these little triangles of granola wrappers everywhere.
[1:09:05 – 1:09:05] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[1:09:06 – 1:09:08] Adam: Oh, he’s thinking, like, that’s a good idea.
[1:09:08 – 1:09:10] Adam: Don’t just change the rule.
[1:09:10 – 1:09:12] Adam: Change how the packaging is made.
[1:09:12 – 1:09:15] Adam: Let’s change the systematic packaging of granola.
[1:09:15 – 1:09:15] Adam: Yeah.
[1:09:15 – 1:09:20] Adam: The way it’s all packaged to begin with to address micro litter at the source.
[1:09:20 – 1:09:22] Erik: How is Rave Dave only got one point?
[1:09:22 – 1:09:25] Adam: Come on, that should be at least, we’re going to award him three extra points.
[1:09:25 – 1:09:26] Erik: For sure.
[1:09:26 – 1:09:27] Adam: He’s up to four points.
[1:09:27 – 1:09:28] Erik: Retroactively.
[1:09:28 – 1:09:29] Adam: Yeah, we can do that.
[1:09:30 – 1:09:33] Adam: We just drew a little line on the piece of paper here.
[1:09:33 – 1:09:33] Adam: Yeah.
[1:09:33 – 1:09:50] Adam: there we go and he’s all the way up to yeah he’s almost he almost made the first page with that boost but yeah let’s just change the entire packaging to reduce micro litter at the source interesting idea thanks i like it that’s bold thinking uh yes
[1:09:51 – 1:09:55] Erik: Yeah, and that’s, I mean, definitely the micro litter.
[1:09:55 – 1:09:56] Erik: It’s everywhere.
[1:09:56 – 1:09:57] Erik: Yeah.
[1:09:57 – 1:09:59] Erik: And it’s all the corners of things.
[1:09:59 – 1:10:04] Adam: Yeah, I don’t know if giving people more trash bags is going to do it, but maybe if you just make the packaging harder to micro litter.
[1:10:06 – 1:10:09] Erik: Northbound paddler.
[1:10:10 – 1:10:14] Erik: This rule only is in the scope of beer consumption.
[1:10:15 – 1:10:15] Erik: Here we go.
[1:10:15 – 1:10:16] Adam: I’m listening.
[1:10:17 – 1:10:17] Erik: Are you?
[1:10:18 – 1:10:18] Erik: I am too.
[1:10:19 – 1:10:20] Erik: Allow metal containers.
[1:10:21 – 1:10:26] Erik: Aluminum cans can be crushed after use and packed down very small.
[1:10:26 – 1:10:29] Erik: making people more apt to take them out.
[1:10:29 – 1:10:41] Erik: Plastic bottles, 40-ouncers, get thrown into the fire by people too lazy to carry the bulky, albeit lightweight, bottle back out with them.
[1:10:42 – 1:10:46] Erik: Witnessed too many shriveled clumps of plastic under a fire grate.
[1:10:48 – 1:10:48] Erik: Here we go.
[1:10:48 – 1:10:49] Erik: Disclaimer.
[1:10:50 – 1:10:54] Erik: This rule change is only in the context of beer in the BWCA.
[1:10:54 – 1:10:56] Erik: I’m not saying it makes sense for food containers.
[1:10:57 – 1:10:58] Erik: Only beer.
[1:10:58 – 1:11:02] Erik: And side note, I enjoy slapping the bag occasionally.
[1:11:02 – 1:11:09] Erik: I recently learned that mixing sweet white wine with a crystal light mix is a great way to shake things up.
[1:11:11 – 1:11:12] Adam: Yeah, I don’t know.
[1:11:12 – 1:11:17] Adam: This summer, just at home, I’ve been mixing La Croix with my wines.
[1:11:18 – 1:11:18] Adam: Like a 50-50.
[1:11:18 – 1:11:19] Adam: Yeah.
[1:11:19 – 1:11:21] Adam: Yeah, give it the razzle dazzle.
[1:11:21 – 1:11:24] Erik: Yeah, well, we talked about the can thing.
[1:11:24 – 1:11:26] Erik: It’s like, yeah, you’re going to pack it in, you’re going to pack it out, it doesn’t matter.
[1:11:26 – 1:11:37] Erik: But he or she, user, really does get even more into detail where, yeah, you think, well, I’m just bringing this plastic container in because it’s lighter, but it’s way bulkier.
[1:11:37 – 1:11:41] Erik: So then you’re probably more apt to feel like you can just throw it into a campfire.
[1:11:42 – 1:11:42] Erik: Yeah.
[1:11:43 – 1:11:43] Erik: Yeah, sure.
[1:11:43 – 1:11:44] Erik: I mean.
[1:11:44 – 1:11:44] Erik: I don’t know.
[1:11:44 – 1:11:45] Erik: It’s.
[1:11:46 – 1:11:47] Erik: I don’t know.
[1:11:47 – 1:11:48] SPEAKER_00: People are going to litter.
[1:11:48 – 1:11:49] SPEAKER_00: They’re going to litter.
[1:11:49 – 1:11:49] SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
[1:11:49 – 1:11:50] Adam: I mean, I just think we should.
[1:11:51 – 1:11:51] Adam: Yeah, I agree.
[1:11:51 – 1:11:53] Adam: Just let people have cans if they want.
[1:11:53 – 1:11:54] Adam: Big deal.
[1:11:54 – 1:11:54] Erik: Yeah.
[1:11:55 – 1:11:56] Adam: Don’t burn.
[1:11:56 – 1:11:56] Erik: Yeah, don’t try.
[1:11:56 – 1:11:57] Erik: I mean.
[1:11:57 – 1:11:58] Adam: Just don’t try and burn it.
[1:11:58 – 1:11:59] Erik: Yeah, that’s one of the rules.
[1:11:59 – 1:11:59] Erik: Like, don’t.
[1:12:00 – 1:12:00] Erik: You can’t burn trash.
[1:12:00 – 1:12:01] Adam: Knuckleheads.
[1:12:01 – 1:12:02] Adam: Don’t burn trash.
[1:12:02 – 1:12:02] Erik: God.
[1:12:03 – 1:12:03] Erik: All right.
[1:12:04 – 1:12:07] Erik: On to where the real arguments occur.
[1:12:08 – 1:12:09] Adam: Printed Facebook.
[1:12:11 – 1:12:11] Adam: Nate.
[1:12:14 – 1:12:15] Adam: What, is this the actual response?
[1:12:17 – 1:12:17] Adam: Yes.
[1:12:19 – 1:12:19] Adam: Nate.
[1:12:19 – 1:12:20] Adam: Facebook Nate.
[1:12:21 – 1:12:21] Adam: One.
[1:12:22 – 1:12:23] Adam: Has he really numbered them?
[1:12:24 – 1:12:24] Adam: He’s got two.
[1:12:25 – 1:12:27] Adam: Yeah, he’s got two, but has he actually numbered them?
[1:12:27 – 1:12:28] Adam: I like it.
[1:12:28 – 1:12:29] Adam: Bullet points.
[1:12:29 – 1:12:30] Adam: One out of two.
[1:12:30 – 1:12:30] Adam: One.
[1:12:30 – 1:12:32] Adam: Reduction in party size limits.
[1:12:33 – 1:12:33] Adam: Two.
[1:12:34 – 1:12:38] Adam: Lakes that are half motor, half paddle should be turned over to all paddle limits.
[1:12:39 – 1:12:41] Erik: Yeah, get rid of the motors, says Nate.
[1:12:41 – 1:12:46] Erik: That’s, I think, a common theme on the Facebook.
[1:12:46 – 1:12:52] Erik: Andy, if you have seen the rules video 20 times, you don’t have to watch it anymore.
[1:12:53 – 1:12:55] Erik: Yeah, this is definitely one.
[1:12:55 – 1:12:57] Adam: Even 20 seems excessive.
[1:12:57 – 1:12:59] Adam: If we’re going down that road, maybe if you’ve seen it three times.
[1:12:59 – 1:12:59] Adam: Yeah.
[1:12:59 – 1:13:23] Erik: I think the U.S. Forest Service, I mean, they could definitely step into the 21st century with that kind of stuff, where especially to alleviate some of the outfitters and cooperators, there should be an option for people to test out online when they secure their permit, and then they can issue it themselves, right?
[1:13:24 – 1:13:24] Erik: Right.
[1:13:24 – 1:13:26] Erik: Like that potential exists.
[1:13:27 – 1:13:38] Erik: As of right now, like the only place that you can get a permit issued is from a cooperator, which is basically an outfitter or a ranger station only a day before your permit.
[1:13:38 – 1:13:43] Adam: Can’t you just like check that person’s paddler rating and then like, okay, they’re over a level 1000.
[1:13:43 – 1:13:44] Adam: They can just have the permit.
[1:13:44 – 1:13:52] Erik: So you want to install a Chinese rating system of the Boundary Waters visitors?
[1:13:52 – 1:13:54] Adam: I don’t know what makes them Chinese.
[1:13:55 – 1:13:56] Erik: Well, that’s what they’re doing to their citizens.
[1:13:57 – 1:13:59] Erik: They’re ranking them.
[1:13:59 – 1:14:01] Erik: We’re not going to go on this rabbit hole, but it is a thing.
[1:14:01 – 1:14:08] Adam: I’m just talking about, yeah, I don’t know who is in charge of the rankings, but yeah, if you’re a good paddler.
[1:14:08 – 1:14:10] Erik: Well, you’re going way past.
[1:14:10 – 1:14:13] Erik: You should just be able to take a little simple test online.
[1:14:13 – 1:14:13] Erik: Yeah.
[1:14:13 – 1:14:16] Adam: I mean, isn’t that what the back of the permit is, is a little test?
[1:14:16 – 1:14:18] Erik: Yeah, you should be able to do that online.
[1:14:18 – 1:14:26] Erik: I guarantee more people would be engaged if they knew that they could just do it and be done with it instead of being forced to do it.
[1:14:26 – 1:14:30] Adam: Right, like when they’re about to get to go on the trip, like on the edge of their seat.
[1:14:30 – 1:14:35] Erik: One person’s watching, six other people are milling around, looking at the, you know, whatever.
[1:14:36 – 1:14:40] Erik: But yeah, I think that video and the permitting issuing can definitely be improved.
[1:14:40 – 1:14:41] Adam: All right.
[1:14:41 – 1:14:44] Adam: Next up, we have Alan Nada.
[1:14:46 – 1:14:46] Adam: That’s it?
[1:14:46 – 1:14:47] Adam: Yeet, yeet.
[1:14:47 – 1:14:48] Adam: All right.
[1:14:48 – 1:14:48] Adam: We’re good.
[1:14:49 – 1:14:52] Adam: And fun fact, Alan spelled backwards is Nada.
[1:14:53 – 1:14:54] Erik: That’s not a fun fact.
[1:14:55 – 1:14:56] Erik: All right.
[1:14:56 – 1:14:56] Erik: Here we go.
[1:14:56 – 1:15:00] Erik: This is the longest response from Bull Moose Patrol.
[1:15:01 – 1:15:08] Erik: Increase group size limit to 10 and allow five canoes, maybe 12 and six.
[1:15:09 – 1:15:19] Erik: This would allow for a more realistic ratio for youth groups that require two adult leaders or help keep prices reasonable for those wanting to use professional guides.
[1:15:20 – 1:15:30] Erik: As long as people are following clean camping etiquette and being respectful of others, it would have no real negative impact on the BWCA.
[1:15:31 – 1:15:37] Erik: And then second paragraph, allow some sites, maybe 10-25% to be reserved.
[1:15:38 – 1:15:41] Erik: This could allow for better trip planning on both ends.
[1:15:43 – 1:15:52] Erik: Those who want to travel fast and far could know that they have a site waiting for them and not have to cruise up and down shorelines or stop early at a site.
[1:15:53 – 1:16:02] Erik: And for those who are not able to travel far and fast, such as with kids or limited physical capacity, could have the peace of mind knowing that their site was reserved.
[1:16:03 – 1:16:09] Erik: Last minute or unplanned trips could get an update from the ranger slash outfitters before shoving off a marauder’s map.
[1:16:10 – 1:16:14] Erik: Yes, active map and know which sites are unavailable.
[1:16:15 – 1:16:25] Erik: Sites are reservable in the Sylvania wilderness, and when I’ve backpacked in other wilderness areas or national park backcountry areas, we had specific sites reserved.
[1:16:26 – 1:16:27] Adam: I’ve been enjoying this.
[1:16:28 – 1:16:28] Adam: Thanks.
[1:16:29 – 1:16:31] Erik: Thank you, Bull Moose Patrol, for the response.
[1:16:32 – 1:16:40] Erik: I think the size of the group is based on some of the responses, I think, that elicited.
[1:16:40 – 1:16:46] Erik: Anybody who wants to go to the Facebook page can follow up on that conversation that was had.
[1:16:46 – 1:16:49] Erik: Seems like kind of a hot button issue a little bit.
[1:16:49 – 1:16:51] Adam: Yeah, that one kind of kept going for a while, huh?
[1:16:51 – 1:16:51] Erik: Yeah.
[1:16:52 – 1:16:54] Adam: Um, yeah, the Sylvania, you’ve been there?
[1:16:55 – 1:16:57] Adam: I’ve been there once and now you do, you can reserve them.
[1:16:57 – 1:16:59] Adam: Like we were like, we’ll take Fisher too.
[1:17:00 – 1:17:06] Adam: Then you get out there and it’s like literally Fisher one and two are like next, right next to each other in the same bay.
[1:17:06 – 1:17:10] Adam: Like they share a common area almost like a common landing.
[1:17:10 – 1:17:10] Erik: Weird.
[1:17:11 – 1:17:13] Adam: I noticed a lot of them were like that when we’re out there.
[1:17:13 – 1:17:14] Adam: Um, they’re like…
[1:17:15 – 1:17:16] Adam: For some reason, they couple them up.
[1:17:16 – 1:17:19] Adam: I assume for really big groups, then you can just reserve both of them, I guess.
[1:17:20 – 1:17:21] Adam: But I don’t know.
[1:17:21 – 1:17:27] Adam: I mean, Sylvania was charming, but yeah, the way they had the campsites doubled up like that a lot.
[1:17:27 – 1:17:30] Adam: And then with the reservations, I don’t know.
[1:17:30 – 1:17:35] Adam: There’s something to that, but also I think something’s lost if you know where you’re going to end up.
[1:17:36 – 1:17:37] Adam: I’m not sure.
[1:17:38 – 1:17:39] Adam: But I enjoyed Sylvania.
[1:17:39 – 1:17:40] Adam: I was glad I got there the one time.
[1:17:40 – 1:17:45] Erik: I mean, I would say 10% to 25% that they suggest it seems high.
[1:17:45 – 1:17:56] Erik: If anything, I would say maybe a few of the bigger lakes that are right on the edge, like a sag or a moose lake or, I mean…
[1:17:57 – 1:18:02] Erik: Beyond that, I don’t think that that would be worth trying to manage.
[1:18:02 – 1:18:03] Erik: I think that’s where it all boils down to.
[1:18:03 – 1:18:06] Adam: What happens if you reserve it and you show up and somebody’s there?
[1:18:06 – 1:18:06] Adam: Yeah.
[1:18:07 – 1:18:07] Erik: Hey.
[1:18:08 – 1:18:09] Adam: I don’t know.
[1:18:09 – 1:18:09] Adam: Yeah.
[1:18:09 – 1:18:10] Adam: You know, maybe.
[1:18:11 – 1:18:14] Erik: Should we figure out the light situation here and then come back?
[1:18:14 – 1:18:15] Adam: I can’t see anything.
[1:18:15 – 1:18:18] Adam: All right.
[1:18:19 – 1:18:20] Adam: So it’s dark out now.
[1:18:21 – 1:18:23] Adam: We’re recording well into the deep end of the night.
[1:18:25 – 1:18:26] Adam: But now we do have some lights on.
[1:18:26 – 1:18:27] Adam: Don’t worry, everyone.
[1:18:28 – 1:18:30] Adam: We can read the printed Facebook.
[1:18:30 – 1:18:31] Adam: Next up is Don.
[1:18:32 – 1:18:33] Adam: Reduce one.
[1:18:34 – 1:18:35] Adam: This one’s also bullet.
[1:18:35 – 1:18:36] Adam: I’m getting all the bullet pointers.
[1:18:36 – 1:18:41] Adam: One, reduce Titan overnight paddle permit quotas at entry points.
[1:18:41 – 1:18:43] Adam: Two, eliminate motorized boats from all the lakes.
[1:18:45 – 1:18:48] Adam: That’s literally the exact same answer as Nate, and I got both of them.
[1:18:49 – 1:18:50] Adam: Nate and Don are on the same page here.
[1:18:51 – 1:18:52] Erik: Wow.
[1:18:52 – 1:18:54] Adam: You want to read the next one for a change?
[1:18:54 – 1:18:54] Adam: You go right ahead.
[1:18:54 – 1:18:55] Adam: Yeah, no, I will.
[1:18:55 – 1:19:00] Adam: First of all, I’d like to say that I thought that Marauder’s Map was made by Tom Riddle.
[1:19:01 – 1:19:01] Adam: Did you?
[1:19:02 – 1:19:04] Adam: No, I thought that, but I looked into it.
[1:19:04 – 1:19:07] Adam: I couldn’t even remember earlier in the episode what it was called, so I had to look it all up.
[1:19:08 – 1:19:08] Adam: It wasn’t.
[1:19:08 – 1:19:09] Adam: It was made by…
[1:19:12 – 1:19:39] Adam: James Potter and Sirius Black obviously and some other guys nobody ever cared about Lupus we talked about the dog star Sirius Mike I would ban any audible electronic device if you want to use a camera GPS or satellite phone for whatever that is fine with me but I do not want to hear music beeping or ringing in the park
[1:19:40 – 1:19:46] Adam: I would also opt for making the entire park barbless in terms of fishing for the sake of human and aquatic health.
[1:19:46 – 1:19:48] Adam: Nice use of the term aquatic health.
[1:19:49 – 1:19:50] Erik: Barbless.
[1:19:50 – 1:19:51] Erik: Hashtag barbless.
[1:19:51 – 1:19:52] Erik: Let’s get that trending.
[1:19:52 – 1:19:53] Erik: I agree.
[1:19:53 – 1:19:54] Erik: Get rid of those barbs.
[1:19:54 – 1:19:55] Adam: Yeah, that one’s easy.
[1:19:55 – 1:19:57] Adam: Get behind barbless for sure.
[1:19:57 – 1:19:57] Adam: Come on.
[1:19:58 – 1:20:02] Erik: If you’re any kind of a fisherman, you don’t need barbs.
[1:20:02 – 1:20:03] Erik: I mean, they’re just trouble.
[1:20:03 – 1:20:04] Erik: They’re barbaric.
[1:20:05 – 1:20:06] Erik: Barbs are barbaric.
[1:20:06 – 1:20:07] Erik: And I agree.
[1:20:08 – 1:20:13] Erik: I didn’t go on a trip one time with some friends who were bringing out a portable Bluetooth speaker.
[1:20:13 – 1:20:15] Erik: I was like, oh, you’re bringing that?
[1:20:16 – 1:20:17] Erik: Good luck.
[1:20:17 – 1:20:18] Erik: I’m going to stay back.
[1:20:18 – 1:20:19] Erik: I’m not going out with you.
[1:20:19 – 1:20:20] Erik: That’s stupid.
[1:20:21 – 1:20:24] Adam: You boycotted a trip over a Bluetooth speaker?
[1:20:24 – 1:20:24] Erik: Yeah.
[1:20:25 – 1:20:25] Erik: I did not go out.
[1:20:25 – 1:20:31] Adam: What about, like, I was playing Terry Flaps on my phone on the man chain last year, I’m pretty sure.
[1:20:32 – 1:20:33] Erik: You didn’t boycott me.
[1:20:33 – 1:20:37] Erik: Yeah, it came out of your phone and it was like two minutes and then it was done.
[1:20:37 – 1:20:41] Erik: It wasn’t an amplified speaker.
[1:20:41 – 1:20:41] Adam: Yeah.
[1:20:42 – 1:20:43] Adam: I don’t know.
[1:20:43 – 1:20:49] Adam: Sometimes I like to listen to a song or two on my phone, like when I’m getting stuff ready for dinner maybe.
[1:20:49 – 1:20:49] Adam: I don’t know.
[1:20:50 – 1:20:50] Erik: Yeah.
[1:20:50 – 1:20:52] Erik: I’m pretty much against it.
[1:20:52 – 1:20:54] Erik: I think it makes the music sound better.
[1:20:54 – 1:20:59] Adam: The weather radio lady is like the computerized weather radio lady.
[1:20:59 – 1:21:02] Adam: That’s kind of like jazz to me when you’re on a long trip.
[1:21:02 – 1:21:04] Adam: You just put that on and it’s soothing.
[1:21:04 – 1:21:07] Adam: It has the effect of music without maybe being as grating.
[1:21:08 – 1:21:09] Adam: Plus it gives you lots of good info.
[1:21:09 – 1:21:16] Erik: I think a weather radio and an occasional scroll of the AM dial at night in the fall is totally fine.
[1:21:16 – 1:21:17] Adam: That’s fun.
[1:21:17 – 1:21:20] Adam: I’ve gotten to listen to a few Packers games that way out in the park.
[1:21:20 – 1:21:21] Adam: That’s pretty nice.
[1:21:22 – 1:21:22] Adam: That’s nice.
[1:21:23 – 1:21:28] Adam: I’d much rather listen to a game on AM radio in the Boundary Waters than actually watch a game on TV.
[1:21:28 – 1:21:29] Erik: Yeah.
[1:21:29 – 1:21:32] SPEAKER_00: With the announcers and the stupid replays.
[1:21:32 – 1:21:33] Adam: Very nostalgic.
[1:21:33 – 1:21:33] Adam: It is.
[1:21:34 – 1:21:36] Adam: Just listen to it around the fire on the old radio.
[1:21:37 – 1:21:37] Erik: Yep.
[1:21:37 – 1:21:40] Erik: It just makes you feel just warm and fuzzy inside.
[1:21:40 – 1:21:41] Adam: It does, yeah.
[1:21:41 – 1:21:42] Adam: So, I don’t know.
[1:21:42 – 1:21:44] Adam: I’m half on board with this, half not on board.
[1:21:44 – 1:21:46] Erik: Depends on how loud the audible device is.
[1:21:46 – 1:21:49] Erik: If I can hear bass, no.
[1:21:49 – 1:21:53] Erik: It has to be 100% treble, zero bass.
[1:21:53 – 1:21:56] Adam: I just laid down a beat for you.
[1:21:56 – 1:21:57] Erik: You want to do something with it?
[1:21:57 – 1:21:59] Erik: I’m going to crank up the bass in post.
[1:21:59 – 1:22:00] Erik: Boom, boom, boom.
[1:22:01 – 1:22:02] Erik: Here we go.
[1:22:03 – 1:22:03] Erik: Yeah.
[1:22:04 – 1:22:04] Erik: Carl.
[1:22:05 – 1:22:06] Erik: Yeet.
[1:22:06 – 1:22:08] Erik: This might be my favorite response, Carl.
[1:22:09 – 1:22:12] Erik: Enforcement of current rules would be awesome.
[1:22:12 – 1:22:12] Erik: Yeah.
[1:22:13 – 1:22:16] Erik: Why don’t we start getting some more people out there enforcing the actual rules?
[1:22:16 – 1:22:17] Erik: Oh, yeah.
[1:22:17 – 1:22:18] Erik: Which I’ll just throw.
[1:22:18 – 1:22:21] Adam: Yeah, I’m sure the Park Service is having their budget increased.
[1:22:21 – 1:22:23] Erik: Well, I’m just going to say it right now.
[1:22:23 – 1:22:30] Erik: It leads right into my actual suggestion, which would be increase the entry fees.
[1:22:31 – 1:22:31] Erik: Increase them.
[1:22:32 – 1:22:46] Erik: It’s one of the cheapest camping experiences you can have, which I understand is nice to allow the majority of people to come up and visit, but I’ve never heard of anybody over the years who I’ve talked to about how
[1:22:48 – 1:22:50] Erik: Honestly, cheap it is.
[1:22:51 – 1:22:53] Erik: Hey, throw another $10 on there per person.
[1:22:53 – 1:22:55] Erik: You could double it.
[1:22:55 – 1:22:58] Erik: $32 per person, but you can stay out for as long as you want.
[1:22:59 – 1:23:01] Adam: Yeah, but most people are doing short trips.
[1:23:01 – 1:23:05] Adam: I know you’re saying like, well, you can go out all year for one fee.
[1:23:05 – 1:23:06] Erik: Well, then make it $20.
[1:23:07 – 1:23:11] Adam: Not everybody’s got a trust fund and can just go paddle around the boundary waters and save it.
[1:23:11 – 1:23:12] Erik: Nobody’s got a trust fund?
[1:23:12 – 1:23:14] Erik: I mean, it’s $20 a person.
[1:23:14 – 1:23:18] Erik: That’s how much it costs to camp per night at any place else in the world.
[1:23:18 – 1:23:21] Adam: I’m just saying, to be able to paddle all year, you’ve got to have some money.
[1:23:21 – 1:23:22] Erik: Well, no, yeah.
[1:23:22 – 1:23:24] Erik: That example is like…
[1:23:24 – 1:23:49] Erik: job that’s a straw man argument for sure saying that yeah you can camp for a whole year on 20 16 but yeah i get most people take like three four night trips either make it more expensive 20 25 to enter or do it nightly i mean i would love to think that if you increase the fees that all that would go back to the boundary waters but i’m pretty sure that’s not how it would work
[1:23:49 – 1:23:53] Erik: Probably going to some Chilean oil king’s pocket somewhere.
[1:23:53 – 1:23:55] Adam: Yeah, or buying a missile or something.
[1:23:55 – 1:24:09] Erik: Yeah, no, and that’s the craziest thing to me is that Cuetico is like four times as expensive, but they don’t actually pay for portage or campsite, like restoration or maintenance.
[1:24:09 – 1:24:09] Erik: Yeah.
[1:24:10 – 1:24:19] Erik: And then there’s the Bajo Waters, which has four times the usage and a quarter of the cost, and they actually maintain their portages and campsites.
[1:24:19 – 1:24:19] Erik: Yeah.
[1:24:19 – 1:24:31] Erik: So what happens is there are literally a handful of people, rangers, out in the park over the course of a year enforcing the rules.
[1:24:31 – 1:24:37] Erik: Whereas all the other money goes to people being at ranger stations.
[1:24:38 – 1:24:47] Erik: So I think half the reason that this list that we’ve gotten from our friends and listeners exists is because the current rules are being under enforced.
[1:24:48 – 1:24:52] Erik: So, and the only way to make that happen is to pay a little bit more to go in.
[1:24:52 – 1:24:53] Adam: Yeah.
[1:24:53 – 1:24:55] Adam: It’s definitely been a while since I’ve seen a ranger.
[1:24:56 – 1:25:01] Erik: Hey, I mean, I’ve run into like two in my life and I, I’ve spent a lot of time out there.
[1:25:01 – 1:25:01] Adam: Yeah.
[1:25:02 – 1:25:02] Adam: Two.
[1:25:04 – 1:25:04] Adam: Yeah.
[1:25:05 – 1:25:06] Adam: That’s a rock fact right there.
[1:25:06 – 1:25:07] Erik: A screen tent.
[1:25:08 – 1:25:23] Adam: Joe, not sure how to change the rule, but the last several years we’ve had to come out of the day before plan because all the sites near the entry point or one easy portage over are piled up with people obviously parked there like a base camp.
[1:25:23 – 1:25:26] Adam: Huge coolers, screen tents.
[1:25:26 – 1:25:27] Adam: You get the picture.
[1:25:27 – 1:25:28] Adam: Yeah, I got it.
[1:25:29 – 1:25:32] Adam: That’s campground, not wilderness-style camping.
[1:25:32 – 1:25:37] Adam: Seriously, yeah, like people are car camping at the edge of the boundary waters and
[1:25:38 – 1:25:39] Erik: I don’t know what you could do about that.
[1:25:39 – 1:25:55] Erik: It’s been a regular topic of conversation about the numbers have maintained the same in terms of usage, but where they’re being used are skyrocketing on the periphery of the park.
[1:25:56 – 1:25:57] Erik: So right on the edge of Portager 2 in.
[1:25:58 – 1:26:00] Adam: Well, yeah, because most people don’t want to do more than a portage or two.
[1:26:00 – 1:26:02] Adam: And you got to just plan on that.
[1:26:02 – 1:26:08] Adam: Like when we were coming, yeah, I mean, yeah, okay, we’re getting pretty close to a, you know, entry point again.
[1:26:08 – 1:26:10] Adam: Yeah, there’s probably going to be a lot more people.
[1:26:10 – 1:26:14] Adam: You just have to kind of expect it and be ready for it.
[1:26:14 – 1:26:27] Erik: Yeah, I guess in lieu of any kind of a regulation to keep people from doing that, I think you just need to adjust your trip to make a longer day in and a longer day out.
[1:26:28 – 1:26:31] Erik: And just in general, avoid Cherokee.
[1:26:33 – 1:26:34] Adam: Poor Cherokee.
[1:26:34 – 1:26:36] Adam: He’s really taken a beating this season.
[1:26:36 – 1:26:36] Erik: Yeah.
[1:26:38 – 1:27:00] Erik: catherine no motors take out all garbage have patrols available for safety and to monitor for fires yeah i mean no more drones you just have drones that are monitoring for fire if they can if they can be silent those like flying silent winged drones yeah the ones that uh
[1:27:00 – 1:27:02] Adam: That’s how you have the updates on the campsites going.
[1:27:02 – 1:27:04] Erik: You just have a drone always watching.
[1:27:04 – 1:27:08] Erik: As long as they’re not those really loud helicopter style ones, that’s fine.
[1:27:09 – 1:27:13] Adam: Ethan, lower the max group size to six or so.
[1:27:13 – 1:27:16] Adam: No motors on any lakes actually in the park.
[1:27:17 – 1:27:19] Adam: What if Lake’s half in the park, though?
[1:27:19 – 1:27:22] Adam: Is it actually in the park, then, or is it actually not?
[1:27:22 – 1:27:22] Adam: I don’t know.
[1:27:22 – 1:27:23] Adam: I don’t know.
[1:27:23 – 1:27:24] Adam: I get it, though.
[1:27:24 – 1:27:25] Adam: No motors.
[1:27:25 – 1:27:26] Erik: I tend to agree.
[1:27:26 – 1:27:26] Erik: I would think…
[1:27:27 – 1:27:32] Adam: I like the Brule setup, where it’s a huge lake and just no motors.
[1:27:32 – 1:27:46] Erik: I tend to agree with the no motors thing because it’s like, all right, out of the 10,000 plus lakes in the state of Minnesota, the amount of lakes that are motor free in the Bon Jovi makes up like less than 5%.
[1:27:47 – 1:27:47] Erik: Yeah.
[1:27:48 – 1:27:52] Erik: Like what’s a couple more that are just motor free?
[1:27:52 – 1:27:52] Adam: Yeah.
[1:27:52 – 1:27:54] Adam: Plus you wouldn’t have to do as many tows then.
[1:27:54 – 1:27:56] Adam: I feel like they shut Clearwater down.
[1:27:56 – 1:27:56] Adam: Yeah.
[1:27:56 – 1:27:59] Adam: But man, those cabin owners would never let it go.
[1:27:59 – 1:28:01] Erik: Well, all right, make it just the mild on the lake then.
[1:28:03 – 1:28:04] SPEAKER_00: Who’s going to stop that?
[1:28:04 – 1:28:08] Erik: There’s already people that make the snowmobile run through the park in the winter.
[1:28:09 – 1:28:10] Adam: Yeehaw.
[1:28:10 – 1:28:13] Adam: Yeah, there’s cowboys out there and cowgirls.
[1:28:13 – 1:28:13] Adam: Watch out.
[1:28:14 – 1:28:15] Erik: Hey, here we go.
[1:28:15 – 1:28:18] Erik: Mark, lower group size to six and three canoes.
[1:28:20 – 1:28:20] Erik: Here we go.
[1:28:21 – 1:28:24] Erik: And no guitars, drums, or music radios just for weather.
[1:28:25 – 1:28:26] Erik: Hey, the weather, yeah.
[1:28:26 – 1:28:27] Erik: Guitars and drums.
[1:28:27 – 1:28:29] Erik: I had the trombone comment.
[1:28:29 – 1:28:30] Adam: Bagpipes, yeah.
[1:28:31 – 1:28:33] Adam: So we’re all clear on the same page.
[1:28:33 – 1:28:34] Adam: No musical instruments.
[1:28:34 – 1:28:37] Adam: Nobody wants to hear your rendition of Melissa Etheridge.
[1:28:38 – 1:28:40] Erik: Yeah, I’m going to go out and practice my… Come to my window.
[1:28:41 – 1:28:41] Erik: Second chair.
[1:28:42 – 1:28:42] Erik: Don’t do it.
[1:28:44 – 1:28:58] Erik: I agree with the smaller size, and I know we had the comment earlier about increasing the size, and I think in general, it probably wouldn’t have any real negative impact, just in terms of…
[1:28:59 – 1:29:05] Erik: Actual usage, but I just don’t think that there are that many campsites that can accommodate any more than…
[1:29:05 – 1:29:07] Erik: I mean, even nine is tough.
[1:29:07 – 1:29:14] Erik: There are only a few campsites that I can think of in the general Clearwater area that can do a nine-person group.
[1:29:15 – 1:29:19] Erik: You start talking about a 12-person group, and then you’ve got five of those…
[1:29:20 – 1:29:39] Erik: six campsites on the lake taken and a group of 12 ends up on one of those smaller sites the amount of impact that that group is going to have on the land is inevitably going to be starting to increase farther and farther out into the woods so yeah like honestly if you want to go with bigger groups then I don’t know maybe like
[1:29:41 – 1:29:53] Adam: Just for day use permits, you can have a bigger, like, hey, just camp on a National Forest campsite if you have that many people and then take a big day trip in or something.
[1:29:53 – 1:29:59] Erik: Yeah, I think the day trip thing is totally fine because it’s like, I don’t really get bothered by seeing big groups.
[1:29:59 – 1:30:02] Adam: Yeah, it’s just that you know, yeah, the campsites can’t handle it.
[1:30:02 – 1:30:05] Erik: The campsites, it’s the overall wear and tear on the land.
[1:30:05 – 1:30:09] Erik: It’s like, inevitably, you go out to Rose Falls, there’s going to be like 40 people out there sometimes.
[1:30:09 – 1:30:09] Erik: No doubt.
[1:30:09 – 1:30:10] Erik: What are you going to do?
[1:30:10 – 1:30:12] Erik: Be like, oh, hey, you guys have to disperse.
[1:30:13 – 1:30:13] Erik: Yeah.
[1:30:13 – 1:30:15] Erik: No, it’s like, I don’t want… No taking pictures for each other.
[1:30:16 – 1:30:17] Erik: Yeah.
[1:30:17 – 1:30:18] Erik: You’re not with each other, are you?
[1:30:19 – 1:30:19] Erik: I don’t want…
[1:30:19 – 1:30:24] Erik: I don’t necessarily want like 12 to 20 people camped at a single campsite.
[1:30:25 – 1:30:25] Erik: So…
[1:30:26 – 1:30:27] Adam: All right, Josh is in.
[1:30:29 – 1:30:33] Adam: This concludes the first page of printed Facebook with Josh’s comment here.
[1:30:34 – 1:30:36] Adam: Hey guys, love the podcast.
[1:30:36 – 1:30:36] Adam: Thank you.
[1:30:37 – 1:30:41] Adam: We listened to a bunch of episodes on our way to and from Mudra last weekend.
[1:30:41 – 1:30:42] Adam: How about no cell coverage?
[1:30:43 – 1:30:48] Adam: I don’t want to hear a companion’s phone buzz with incoming texts while they’re, yeah.
[1:30:49 – 1:30:51] Erik: Refer to episode five, The Wireless Road.
[1:30:51 – 1:30:56] Adam: Yeah, I don’t think it’s any secret that we despise the celly when it’s out in the park.
[1:30:56 – 1:30:57] Adam: No cellies.
[1:30:57 – 1:30:57] Adam: No cellies.
[1:30:58 – 1:30:59] Adam: Boo.
[1:30:59 – 1:31:01] Adam: But, you know, it’s going to happen, Josh.
[1:31:02 – 1:31:03] Adam: Be ready for it.
[1:31:05 – 1:31:07] Adam: At least put your phone on silent mode.
[1:31:07 – 1:31:10] Adam: We need that as part of the new video.
[1:31:10 – 1:31:12] Adam: It’s like the little clip from when you’re in the movie theater.
[1:31:13 – 1:31:14] Adam: Please silence your phones.
[1:31:15 – 1:31:17] Adam: My phone’s been silent for five years.
[1:31:17 – 1:31:17] Adam: Why would I?
[1:31:19 – 1:31:25] Erik: Nikki, no changes until Forest Service portage crews are funded back to acceptable levels.
[1:31:26 – 1:31:29] Erik: Five years ago, there were two to three times the amount of rangers there are today.
[1:31:29 – 1:31:31] Erik: This is why enforcement is an issue.
[1:31:32 – 1:31:40] Erik: I don’t know if that’s necessarily a fact or not in terms of the two to three times versus today or five years ago.
[1:31:40 – 1:31:51] Erik: But I do know that the funding has definitely been shifted a little bit more towards kind of like front of the house, people at the front desk of the ranger stations versus… Has it been?
[1:31:51 – 1:31:51] Erik: Yeah.
[1:31:52 – 1:31:55] Adam: Yeah, I’m not holding my breath for the Forest Service getting any extra funding.
[1:31:55 – 1:31:55] Adam: No.
[1:31:55 – 1:31:56] Adam: The way things are going.
[1:31:57 – 1:31:57] Erik: No.
[1:31:58 – 1:31:59] Adam: No, it’s probably not going to happen.
[1:32:00 – 1:32:01] Adam: Let’s be honest.
[1:32:01 – 1:32:02] Erik: Police yourselves…
[1:32:05 – 1:32:09] Adam: There’s not a lot of corporate profit to be made off of the National Park Service.
[1:32:09 – 1:32:09] Adam: Sorry.
[1:32:09 – 1:32:11] Erik: You should do a serious, you know, the Ely.
[1:32:12 – 1:32:17] Erik: They did that April Fool’s thing with the Dairy Queen Boundary Waters Canoe Area.
[1:32:17 – 1:32:18] Erik: They were sponsored.
[1:32:18 – 1:32:20] Erik: That just might be what we have to do.
[1:32:20 – 1:32:22] Erik: Let’s get some sponsorships going for the park.
[1:32:23 – 1:32:24] Erik: Private interests.
[1:32:24 – 1:32:25] Erik: Come on.
[1:32:26 – 1:32:29] Adam: Basswood Lake presented by Dairy Queen.
[1:32:30 – 1:32:34] Adam: Hot eats, cool treats, and nice views.
[1:32:34 – 1:32:35] Erik: Lots of rock bass.
[1:32:36 – 1:32:43] Adam: Antonio, if you’re a regular in the BWCA, then you should be allowed the option to print your permit or have it mailed.
[1:32:43 – 1:32:47] Adam: This saves time if you have all your own gear and just want to head straight to your entry point.
[1:32:48 – 1:32:50] Adam: What, you don’t want to hang out with the rangers at the front of the house?
[1:32:51 – 1:32:51] Adam: Hey.
[1:32:51 – 1:32:52] Adam: That’s where they’re putting all the resources.
[1:32:52 – 1:32:53] Erik: There it is.
[1:32:54 – 1:32:55] Erik: I think we’ve come to a conclusion.
[1:32:56 – 1:33:02] Erik: We live in a day and age where people can test to, they can go to college online.
[1:33:02 – 1:33:03] Adam: Yeah.
[1:33:03 – 1:33:05] Erik: You can get a degree online.
[1:33:05 – 1:33:17] Erik: You should be able to test out of your Boundary Waters Leave No Trace ethics video and completely remove the front of the house ranger stations and put those people in the field.
[1:33:18 – 1:33:19] Erik: Hey.
[1:33:19 – 1:33:19] Erik: There it is.
[1:33:19 – 1:33:21] Erik: We’re an hour and a half in or whatever.
[1:33:21 – 1:33:22] Erik: This is the longest episode ever.
[1:33:22 – 1:33:25] Adam: Get out from behind the desk and actually get in the field.
[1:33:25 – 1:33:25] Erik: Yeah.
[1:33:26 – 1:33:30] Erik: Enforce the rules that you have had people go through a test to issue themselves.
[1:33:30 – 1:33:32] Adam: The problem isn’t that they don’t know the rules.
[1:33:32 – 1:33:34] Adam: It’s just there’s a couple knuckleheads out there.
[1:33:35 – 1:33:35] Adam: You got to catch them.
[1:33:36 – 1:33:37] Adam: Everybody else is pretty cool.
[1:33:38 – 1:33:38] Erik: Yeah.
[1:33:38 – 1:33:40] Erik: Speaking of knuckleheads, Tori.
[1:33:40 – 1:33:41] Erik: Oh, man.
[1:33:41 – 1:33:45] Erik: Bring back cans so I don’t have to drink flat beer out of a plastic jug grower.
[1:33:45 – 1:33:47] Adam: It wouldn’t be flat if you drank it on the first night.
[1:33:48 – 1:33:48] Adam: And drank faster.
[1:33:49 – 1:33:50] Adam: Yeah, drink it faster.
[1:33:50 – 1:33:51] Erik: You don’t drink fast enough, Tori.
[1:33:51 – 1:33:52] Erik: You have to drink faster.
[1:33:52 – 1:33:55] Adam: Put it down as soon as you get into your campsite the first night.
[1:33:57 – 1:33:59] Adam: The beer in the plastic grower is only for night one.
[1:33:59 – 1:34:00] Adam: It has to be.
[1:34:01 – 1:34:07] Adam: Now, if you want to have a beer on the second night, you’ve got to go with the plastic 40s, but apparently people are trying to burn those.
[1:34:08 – 1:34:09] Erik: Don’t burn plastic.
[1:34:09 – 1:34:10] Erik: I mean, jeez.
[1:34:10 – 1:34:14] Erik: You want to do that down in Missouri or wherever you’re from?
[1:34:14 – 1:34:14] Erik: No.
[1:34:14 – 1:34:17] Erik: All right, so we’ve got to keep this episode under.
[1:34:18 – 1:34:21] Adam: All the people from Missouri are upset with us.
[1:34:21 – 1:34:22] Adam: They’re not happy in Jefferson City.
[1:34:22 – 1:34:23] Adam: Nope.
[1:34:23 – 1:34:25] Adam: They’re not happy in the Ozarks.
[1:34:25 – 1:34:26] Erik: Yeah, we have to keep this under.
[1:34:26 – 1:34:27] Adam: Very little paddling down there.
[1:34:28 – 1:34:30] Erik: Our goal forever is going to be to keep this under two hours.
[1:34:31 – 1:34:31] Erik: I don’t know.
[1:34:31 – 1:34:33] Erik: Maybe people want to listen to two hours of us rambling.
[1:34:33 – 1:34:34] Adam: I want to.
[1:34:34 – 1:34:35] Adam: It’s the middle of the summer.
[1:34:35 – 1:34:36] Adam: Let’s do it.
[1:34:36 – 1:34:36] Adam: Yeah.
[1:34:36 – 1:34:37] Adam: I got something to say.
[1:34:37 – 1:34:38] Erik: Do it.
[1:34:38 – 1:34:39] Adam: All right.
[1:34:39 – 1:34:40] Adam: So I was thinking about it today.
[1:34:40 – 1:34:46] Adam: Doggo and I went for a little hike, and I was kind of like, well, you know, I know we’re going to record tonight.
[1:34:46 – 1:34:47] Adam: What would I really change?
[1:34:47 – 1:34:52] Adam: Like, I know we’ve been reading these comments, and there’s a lot of good ideas here and there.
[1:34:54 – 1:35:01] Adam: And then I remember the PMAs, primitive management areas.
[1:35:02 – 1:35:09] Adam: And we were kind of talking how I don’t think it’s any secret either that we really like the Quetico regulations.
[1:35:09 – 1:35:14] Adam: And we’ve had a few people suggest tonight some ideas that they use in Quetico already.
[1:35:15 – 1:35:24] Adam: Um, but, uh, yeah, the PMAs, there’s these little like crazy areas off the beaten trail where they don’t really do any, they don’t clear it.
[1:35:24 – 1:35:27] Adam: They don’t really maintain it in any way, but you can still like go in there.
[1:35:27 – 1:35:29] Adam: You just need to get your normal permit.
[1:35:29 – 1:35:38] Adam: And then on top of that, another permit, who doesn’t need more permits, more permitting, more time spent at headquarters, less in the field.
[1:35:39 – 1:35:43] Adam: But I think it’s kind of a neat idea, and I’ve always wanted to go check one of those out.
[1:35:43 – 1:35:46] Adam: And then, so I don’t know, on this hike today, it kind of dawned on me.
[1:35:47 – 1:35:50] Adam: What we need is just to expand the PMAs.
[1:35:52 – 1:36:03] Adam: And basically, we’ll turn the boundary waters into like a three-tiered zone where right around the, this is kind of a synthesis of everything we’ve been talking about tonight as well.
[1:36:04 – 1:36:04] Erik: All right.
[1:36:05 – 1:36:13] Adam: A lot of these ideas kind of go into this grand idea I’ve been thinking on where like around the major entry points is like considered zone one.
[1:36:14 – 1:36:19] Adam: And this is, you can have a bigger group size there, possibly some campsites that are reserved in zone one.
[1:36:19 – 1:36:22] Adam: It’s concentrated around the areas where you’re going to have motorboat traffic perhaps.
[1:36:23 – 1:36:27] Adam: It’s not the pure boundary waters, but you’re on the edge, the periphery of the boundary waters.
[1:36:27 – 1:36:29] Adam: It’s not a primitive management zone.
[1:36:29 – 1:36:31] Adam: It’s just kind of the periphery management zone.
[1:36:31 – 1:36:34] Erik: Kind of like a Sylvania wilderness.
[1:36:34 – 1:36:35] Adam: Yeah, it’s kind of a Sylvania setup.
[1:36:35 – 1:36:37] Adam: You can reserve these campsites.
[1:36:37 – 1:36:39] Adam: They’re bigger campsites.
[1:36:39 – 1:36:41] Adam: They can accommodate groups of up to, like, 15 if you want.
[1:36:42 – 1:36:42] Adam: We don’t care.
[1:36:43 – 1:36:47] Adam: And, yeah, maybe, hell, you can have guides in there, fishing guides.
[1:36:47 – 1:36:52] Adam: You know, the bigger lakes that are already entry point lakes, these will all fall into that area.
[1:36:52 – 1:36:52] Adam: Yeah.
[1:36:53 – 1:36:55] Adam: And then you still have the primitive management zones.
[1:36:55 – 1:37:02] Adam: Like if you want to go to hairy Lake or you want to go to swollen ankle Lake, you’d go right ahead and do whatever you want out there.
[1:37:02 – 1:37:07] Adam: And you don’t, uh, you don’t need, there’s not going to have any enforcement out there.
[1:37:07 – 1:37:08] Adam: If you’re brave enough to go to hairy.
[1:37:09 – 1:37:09] Adam: Oh boy.
[1:37:09 – 1:37:11] Adam: So is that like the level three?
[1:37:11 – 1:37:12] Adam: That’s level three then.
[1:37:12 – 1:37:19] Adam: And then in the middle now would be like a level two would be more like a Quetico style where they’re not really patrolling it as much.
[1:37:20 – 1:37:23] Adam: And the portages might not be as maintained.
[1:37:23 – 1:37:26] Adam: And the group size there would be down to six.
[1:37:27 – 1:37:29] Adam: So this is more of an advanced course.
[1:37:29 – 1:37:30] Adam: Yes.
[1:37:30 – 1:37:33] Adam: And then, yeah, the primitive management zones would be the ultimate.
[1:37:33 – 1:37:35] Adam: Like nothing’s going on out there.
[1:37:35 – 1:37:36] Adam: It’s pure wild.
[1:37:36 – 1:37:36] Erik: Yeah.
[1:37:37 – 1:37:38] Adam: Now here’s the kicker.
[1:37:38 – 1:37:39] Erik: Here we go.
[1:37:40 – 1:37:43] Adam: To get to level two, you don’t just get to go to level two.
[1:37:44 – 1:37:47] Adam: They don’t just let people enter the Iditarod like, hey, I got some dogs.
[1:37:47 – 1:37:48] Adam: Let me in the Iditarod.
[1:37:48 – 1:37:49] Adam: I got my entry fee.
[1:37:50 – 1:37:50] Adam: No, come on, guy.
[1:37:50 – 1:37:51] Adam: Can you really do that?
[1:37:52 – 1:37:53] Adam: No.
[1:37:53 – 1:37:56] Adam: To get to level two, you have to earn it by camping level one.
[1:37:56 – 1:37:56] Adam: Okay.
[1:38:00 – 1:38:11] Adam: So if you got to have maybe a trip or two under your belt at level one, have watched the video and actually like gone through the rules with the ranger for the first group, you know, your first trip in.
[1:38:11 – 1:38:11] Erik: Yeah.
[1:38:11 – 1:38:16] Adam: And then once you’ve gotten your stamp for your level one trip, then you’re leveled up.
[1:38:16 – 1:38:20] Adam: Now you’re allowed to like, yeah, like, okay, now you’ve qualified to try level two.
[1:38:21 – 1:38:31] Adam: And then maybe after 10 level 2 trips, then you can qualify for a PMA trip to go to, you know, fish or… Fungus.
[1:38:31 – 1:38:36] Erik: Fungus or hairy, mugwaba, nakwaka.
[1:38:36 – 1:38:40] Erik: The fact that those level 1 campsites could be reservable…
[1:38:41 – 1:38:50] Erik: would also make it very easy for you to actually be graded on how you left a campsite.
[1:38:51 – 1:38:51] Erik: Right.
[1:38:52 – 1:38:55] Adam: Yeah, you’d almost be able to review how the campsite was.
[1:38:55 – 1:38:56] Adam: Like, hey, we came in.
[1:38:56 – 1:38:56] Adam: I don’t know.
[1:38:56 – 1:38:59] Adam: There’s little edges of granola wrappers everywhere.
[1:38:59 – 1:39:01] Adam: Oh, we know who was there last.
[1:39:01 – 1:39:02] Erik: Yeah, exactly.
[1:39:02 – 1:39:03] Adam: Then they don’t pass.
[1:39:03 – 1:39:05] Adam: It all goes into your grading as a camper.
[1:39:05 – 1:39:13] Erik: The biggest issue with trying to enforce some of these things is you come to a trashed campsite and you’re like, well, I have no idea who is here.
[1:39:13 – 1:39:13] Erik: Yeah.
[1:39:13 – 1:39:14] Erik: I don’t even know where to start.
[1:39:14 – 1:39:18] Adam: So mainly let’s take them all out of the offices and the headquarters.
[1:39:18 – 1:39:21] Adam: We’ll put 90% of the resources into patrolling zone one.
[1:39:22 – 1:39:23] Adam: Teach people the right way to do it.
[1:39:23 – 1:39:24] Adam: Enforce the people there.
[1:39:25 – 1:39:32] Adam: Maybe you have some patrols in zone two and you got to kind of watch those portages and they’re never going to go like back to nature like some of these PMAs go.
[1:39:32 – 1:39:32] Erik: Yeah.
[1:39:33 – 1:39:34] Adam: There’s still going to be portages there.
[1:39:34 – 1:39:35] Adam: It’ll be very Quetico-esque.
[1:39:35 – 1:39:39] Adam: And maybe, you know, you still have the campsites that are there, but people could camp anywhere they wanted.
[1:39:39 – 1:39:43] Adam: But most people just camp at the old campsites.
[1:39:43 – 1:39:45] Adam: You know, so that’s a little bit more advanced.
[1:39:45 – 1:39:49] Adam: And then the final level is you can really go wild into the backcountry.
[1:39:50 – 1:39:55] Adam: But I would just say like most of the resources should be in the areas where most of the people are and where the new people are.
[1:39:55 – 1:39:56] Erik: Yes.
[1:39:56 – 1:39:58] Adam: And then you can have bigger group sizes there.
[1:39:58 – 1:40:00] Adam: Then the middle zone, you got maybe six persons per group.
[1:40:01 – 1:40:03] Adam: And then finally the PMA is the really deep stuff.
[1:40:03 – 1:40:05] Adam: Like just it’s for only for like groups of four.
[1:40:06 – 1:40:12] Erik: And some of the PMAs would maybe even fringe into some of those more deep Bonjouaris routes, like some of those, like Laos River.
[1:40:13 – 1:40:13] Erik: Well, yeah.
[1:40:13 – 1:40:15] Erik: Some of those would even be, like, a level three area.
[1:40:15 – 1:40:17] Adam: I was looking at, like, the Frost River loop we did.
[1:40:17 – 1:40:21] Adam: The entire inside of that loop is PMA 10.
[1:40:21 – 1:40:22] Adam: Mm-hmm.
[1:40:22 – 1:40:23] Adam: That’s the hairy lake area.
[1:40:23 – 1:40:23] Adam: Yeah.
[1:40:23 – 1:40:25] Adam: There’s all these little lakes in there.
[1:40:25 – 1:40:29] Adam: So, yeah, we just, like, looped around it, and that’s all pretty wild, but then you can even go wilder than that.
[1:40:29 – 1:40:30] Adam: Like, that’s pretty cool.
[1:40:30 – 1:40:31] Adam: So…
[1:40:31 – 1:40:32] Erik: Yeah, no, I like that.
[1:40:32 – 1:40:33] Erik: That’s a great combination.
[1:40:33 – 1:40:37] Adam: It’s got a tiered system that you can have a balance of all the things we’ve been talking about here.
[1:40:37 – 1:40:42] Erik: And it’s only going to get more intense in usage.
[1:40:42 – 1:40:44] Erik: And something is going to have to…
[1:40:46 – 1:41:12] Erik: come along that addresses that and it currently in its current form of regulations is basically I think it’s under enforced it’s overused on the edges it’s underfunded the way that the current system is set up and I think that we’ve thrown on a few ideas that I think can alleviate those things just to boil it down
[1:41:13 – 1:41:41] Erik: have the ability for people to issue their own permits at home via a online especially for advanced campers yeah especially as they progress we have technology like this at our disposal yeah let’s see the metrics the money and increase the usage especially the fees increase that not greatly but increase it the only increase that i’ve seen in fees lately has just gone to the third party that manages the recreation.gov website
[1:41:42 – 1:41:46] Erik: Usage permits have not increased for 12 years.
[1:41:48 – 1:41:53] Erik: So you could take the people that aren’t sitting at ranger stations…
[1:41:55 – 1:42:00] Erik: You can put them in the field or at least the money that’s paying them towards people, they can be out in the field.
[1:42:01 – 1:42:16] Erik: And then you can also address the fact that there are many more people just visiting the peripheries and some of those folks that are wanting to use larger spaces or come out with larger groups, like you said, break it down into maybe a tiered system.
[1:42:16 – 1:42:27] Erik: I think the biggest question that I would have in terms of logistics as how you would manage that is people that want to cross from different sections.
[1:42:27 – 1:42:29] Erik: If you want to paddle across the whole…
[1:42:30 – 1:42:31] Erik: If you want to paddle from Ely to…
[1:42:33 – 1:42:58] Erik: the gunflint trail what kind of like permit does that require and you know how does that logistically shake out in terms of where you can camp and what you want to run into or is it just upon the user to figure it out you know but i think that there is definitely something there i don’t know maybe maybe you know it’s just uh we’re thinking out loud here
[1:42:58 – 1:43:00] Erik: Yeah, that’s what it’s all about.
[1:43:00 – 1:43:07] Erik: I definitely think that we have come to a couple of conclusions, and I don’t know if anything will ever come from it.
[1:43:07 – 1:43:15] Erik: But, you know, with that, should we see what that blinking red light over in the corner is all about?
[1:43:15 – 1:43:17] Adam: Oh, yeah, it looks like we have a call.
[1:43:17 – 1:43:20] Adam: And then we’ve got to go on and get it, I think.
[1:43:20 – 1:43:22] Erik: Try to get out of here under two hours?
[1:43:23 – 1:43:24] Erik: Yeah, let’s hit it.
[1:43:24 – 1:43:24] Erik: Let’s do it.
[1:43:27 – 1:43:27] SPEAKER_00: Hi, guys.
[1:43:28 – 1:43:36] SPEAKER_00: It’s the geologist wife calling in to the No Longer Pete hotline.
[1:43:37 – 1:43:38] SPEAKER_00: Just going to put that out there.
[1:43:38 – 1:43:49] SPEAKER_00: I thought I’d share a little opinion with you that I developed while camping with some girlfriends.
[1:43:50 – 1:43:56] SPEAKER_00: Our camping life revolves around hammocking, as many of you know.
[1:43:59 – 1:44:06] SPEAKER_00: I was under the assumption that the double nest was the only way to go, no matter what season.
[1:44:07 – 1:44:21] SPEAKER_00: So when I was packing for my camping trip, I accidentally took a single nest, which is a lot less fabric, and I was setting it up, and I was like, oh, man, this is going to suck.
[1:44:23 – 1:44:23] SPEAKER_00: And it didn’t.
[1:44:24 – 1:44:28] SPEAKER_00: And it was awesome because this is why.
[1:44:29 – 1:44:33] SPEAKER_00: There’s a bug net, you know, because it’s July and the bugs are pretty bad at night.
[1:44:34 – 1:44:39] SPEAKER_00: And I put it up, put the bug net on, got my sleeping pad and sleeping bag in there.
[1:44:40 – 1:44:51] SPEAKER_00: And I got in and there was no fabric in my way over my face, cutting off my air supply.
[1:44:51 – 1:44:53] SPEAKER_00: I had the bug net over me.
[1:44:54 – 1:44:58] SPEAKER_00: I didn’t need the extra fabric over my face, making me all hot and stuffy.
[1:44:59 – 1:45:01] SPEAKER_00: And it was fabulous.
[1:45:01 – 1:45:07] SPEAKER_00: So I recommend in the summer using a single nest.
[1:45:08 – 1:45:14] SPEAKER_00: And in the winter or fall, spring, when it’s cooler, you might want that extra little insulation.
[1:45:16 – 1:45:17] SPEAKER_00: Use a double nest.
[1:45:17 – 1:45:20] SPEAKER_00: But I am very happy with my discovery.
[1:45:21 – 1:45:22] SPEAKER_00: And I just thought I’d share it with you guys.
[1:45:22 – 1:45:23] SPEAKER_00: So…
[1:45:25 – 1:45:28] SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think that’s all I have for now.
[1:45:28 – 1:45:30] SPEAKER_00: I’m going to call back probably again.
[1:45:30 – 1:45:37] SPEAKER_00: So, you know, get working on that new name because, sorry, Pete, now we can share.
[1:45:37 – 1:45:38] SPEAKER_00: Okay, bye-bye.
[1:45:42 – 1:45:45] Adam: All right, the answering machine, we’re back.
[1:45:46 – 1:45:50] Adam: And have you ever been in a single nest?
[1:45:51 – 1:45:52] Adam: So it’s a narrower?
[1:45:53 – 1:45:56] Erik: Yeah, not as much fabric flapping around.
[1:45:57 – 1:46:06] Erik: I can’t remember the last time I was in one, and I think that that really makes me want to try to get back into one, especially in the summer.
[1:46:06 – 1:46:17] Erik: I don’t necessarily mind the extra nylon fabric because I always take a sleeping pad out, which always kind of spreads it out.
[1:46:18 – 1:46:20] Erik: But I’m intrigued at the very least.
[1:46:20 – 1:46:22] Erik: I definitely want to try it now.
[1:46:22 – 1:46:24] Erik: Especially, you know, that was always our thing.
[1:46:25 – 1:46:29] Erik: You just wrap yourself up in the extra fabric and there’s no bugs.
[1:46:29 – 1:46:32] Erik: But it’s like, okay, well, we also have bug nests.
[1:46:33 – 1:46:37] Adam: Yeah, my only experience with the single nest was on a trip way back now.
[1:46:38 – 1:46:40] Adam: My buddy Tyler was up here.
[1:46:41 – 1:46:44] Adam: And he had a single nest, and I had the double nest.
[1:46:44 – 1:46:52] Adam: And then he was really complaining about it, like he felt his shoulders were being pinched by the thinner or the narrower hammock.
[1:46:53 – 1:46:53] Adam: Sure.
[1:46:53 – 1:46:57] Adam: So I was always like, yeah, I mean, I’m… That can happen in a double, though, too.
[1:46:57 – 1:46:57] Erik: Yeah.
[1:46:58 – 1:46:59] Erik: Just depends on the set.
[1:46:59 – 1:47:01] Adam: Just how you have it set or how you’re in there.
[1:47:01 – 1:47:03] Adam: Maybe he wasn’t totally used to hammocking, so… Yeah.
[1:47:04 – 1:47:09] Adam: It kind of always stuck with me, and I already had the double nest, so I just never attempted the single, so…
[1:47:09 – 1:47:10] Adam: Something more to think about.
[1:47:11 – 1:47:11] Adam: Yes.
[1:47:12 – 1:47:13] Adam: And there goes the light.
[1:47:13 – 1:47:15] Adam: So I guess that’s our sign.
[1:47:15 – 1:47:17] Adam: It’s time to wrap this one up.
[1:47:18 – 1:47:18] Erik: Well, wait, wait, wait.
[1:47:19 – 1:47:24] Erik: We just have to let it be known that the Pete line only lasted a week.
[1:47:25 – 1:47:25] Adam: Yeah.
[1:47:26 – 1:47:28] Adam: Well, it was never going to last, was it?
[1:47:29 – 1:47:30] Adam: Tori put it to bed.
[1:47:30 – 1:47:33] Adam: Tori’s top tips.
[1:47:33 – 1:47:35] Erik: The Tori tip line now.
[1:47:36 – 1:47:39] Adam: I just like the answer because it is actually this answering machine.
[1:47:40 – 1:47:41] Adam: Just the answering machine.
[1:47:41 – 1:47:42] Adam: Our answering machine.
[1:47:42 – 1:47:43] Adam: Call and leave us a message.
[1:47:44 – 1:47:44] Adam: Ask a question.
[1:47:45 – 1:47:46] Adam: Tell us a story.
[1:47:46 – 1:47:49] Adam: Whatever you want to do, the answering machine’s always there.
[1:47:50 – 1:47:51] Adam: Call us the middle of the night.
[1:47:51 – 1:47:52] Adam: You can call us early in the morning.
[1:47:52 – 1:47:53] Adam: It doesn’t matter.
[1:47:53 – 1:47:56] Erik: It’s definitely no longer the Pete line.
[1:47:56 – 1:47:58] Erik: Sorry, Pete, but thanks.
[1:47:58 – 1:47:59] Erik: Thanks, but no thanks.
[1:47:59 – 1:48:01] Erik: But seriously, thanks, Pete.
[1:48:02 – 1:48:03] Erik: Thanks, Tori.
[1:48:04 – 1:48:06] Adam: Thanks for the… Who else is going to get on this?
[1:48:06 – 1:48:07] Erik: The insight.
[1:48:07 – 1:48:10] Erik: I am actually very intrigued on the single nest.
[1:48:10 – 1:48:16] Erik: You just get so stuck in a way of doing things, you just assume it’s the best.
[1:48:16 – 1:48:17] Adam: Well, I just have a double nest.
[1:48:17 – 1:48:19] Adam: I’m not going to buy a second hammock.
[1:48:19 – 1:48:20] Adam: I have one that I’m happy with.
[1:48:20 – 1:48:23] Erik: You better buy a single nest now and try one out with me.
[1:48:23 – 1:48:23] Adam: No.
[1:48:24 – 1:48:24] Adam: Well, maybe.
[1:48:24 – 1:48:25] Adam: I will.
[1:48:25 – 1:48:25] Adam: All right.
[1:48:26 – 1:48:29] Adam: But, I mean, just seriously, though, like, a year from now, people are going to be around.
[1:48:29 – 1:48:33] Adam: Remember the first three people that called into the answering machine?
[1:48:33 – 1:48:35] Adam: It was Pete and then Tori and then…
[1:48:37 – 1:48:40] Adam: Any of you could be the third, and you’re going to make history in the making.
[1:48:41 – 1:48:43] Adam: You’re going to just let Pete and Tori have all the fun, I suppose.
[1:48:44 – 1:48:47] Adam: But anyways, the number is in the show notes.
[1:48:47 – 1:48:48] Adam: Check it out.
[1:48:48 – 1:48:51] Erik: I was scrambling for my phone, which has it, but it’s dark now.
[1:48:52 – 1:49:00] Erik: Do you think people can figure out what our studio is now based on the last few weeks of us doing this and saying… What the hell is my phone?
[1:49:00 – 1:49:02] Erik: Yeah, we don’t know what’s going on.
[1:49:02 – 1:49:03] Erik: You don’t want to find us.
[1:49:03 – 1:49:04] Erik: Come on.
[1:49:04 – 1:49:09] Erik: Tumble Homecast, Gmail, Facebook, RBWCA.
[1:49:10 – 1:49:11] Erik: Do we want to tease next week’s question?
[1:49:12 – 1:49:14] Adam: Yeah, and it’s a big one.
[1:49:14 – 1:49:23] Adam: And I was contemplating maybe we have to possibly give this one two weeks of responses because it’s a really big question.
[1:49:24 – 1:49:25] Erik: We’re doing boats, right?
[1:49:25 – 1:49:26] Adam: Yeah, it’s boats.
[1:49:26 – 1:49:27] Erik: Right.
[1:49:28 – 1:49:29] Erik: What paddles your boat?
[1:49:30 – 1:49:31] Erik: What boat?
[1:49:32 – 1:49:34] Erik: What boat do you float?
[1:49:35 – 1:49:37] Erik: I mean, we got to get to this before…
[1:49:39 – 1:49:40] Erik: before the snow flies.
[1:49:41 – 1:49:42] Erik: What’s your boat of choice?
[1:49:42 – 1:49:43] Erik: Do you have a boat?
[1:49:43 – 1:49:44] Erik: Do you own a canoe?
[1:49:44 – 1:49:45] Erik: Do you own a kayak?
[1:49:45 – 1:49:46] Erik: Do you rent?
[1:49:46 – 1:49:48] Erik: What are you looking for out there on the water?
[1:49:50 – 1:49:55] Erik: I can imagine many different, very distinct opinions and thoughts.
[1:49:56 – 1:49:58] Erik: We have ours.
[1:49:58 – 1:50:03] Erik: You may or may not know what ours are at this point, but they are definitely there.
[1:50:04 – 1:50:10] Erik: We’ll talk about all of the options out there, but we’ll throw it out there on the places that they get thrown out on.
[1:50:11 – 1:50:16] Erik: But if you’re listening, yeah, we’re going to be talking about boats next week.
[1:50:16 – 1:50:19] Adam: I don’t want to just hear like, yeah, I like a men too or whatever.
[1:50:20 – 1:50:21] Adam: Like why though?
[1:50:21 – 1:50:22] Adam: And how did you get to that boat?
[1:50:23 – 1:50:25] Adam: I want to hear the story of your individual boat.
[1:50:26 – 1:50:26] Adam: Yeah.
[1:50:26 – 1:50:29] Adam: Almost more so than like why you like your make and model or whatever.
[1:50:30 – 1:50:31] Adam: Because they’re all good, you know.
[1:50:32 – 1:50:34] Adam: I mean, if it floats, that’s good.
[1:50:34 – 1:50:40] Adam: Unless you’re saying you like a 71 grumman, 18 and a half foot three person, then I don’t know what you’re on.
[1:50:40 – 1:50:47] Adam: But yeah, like not just like what boat you like, but also like how did you get your boat?
[1:50:47 – 1:50:50] Adam: Like your first boat or the boat you’re currently paddling.
[1:50:50 – 1:50:52] Adam: Like we want to hear a lot about that too.
[1:50:52 – 1:50:54] Adam: So let’s try and expand on this.
[1:50:56 – 1:51:01] Adam: It’s really the backbone of every trip into the park is the boat.
[1:51:01 – 1:51:03] Adam: It’s amazing we’ve gone this far without actually getting to.
[1:51:04 – 1:51:04] Adam: Yeah.
[1:51:04 – 1:51:05] Erik: What’s your favorite boat?
[1:51:05 – 1:51:09] Erik: It’s a very intimate and personal opinion.
[1:51:09 – 1:51:15] Erik: And I think that there’s not really going to be any way that we will be able to discount anybody’s opinion on this.
[1:51:16 – 1:51:18] Erik: But it’s always a fun topic of conversation.
[1:51:19 – 1:51:26] Erik: And if this episode is any indication, next week’s episode will surely be well over three hours.
[1:51:27 – 1:51:29] Erik: And we’ll be talking boats.
[1:51:30 – 1:51:31] Erik: We’ll stay in touch.
[1:51:32 – 1:51:35] Erik: And until next time, burp.
[1:51:36 – 1:51:37] Erik: Arrivederci.
[1:51:38 – 1:51:39] Adam: No, happy paddling.
[1:51:39 – 1:51:40] Adam: Come on.
[1:51:40 – 1:51:41] Adam: Happy paddling.
[1:51:41 – 1:51:41] Adam: I’m Adam.
[1:51:42 – 1:51:42] Adam: I’m Eric.
[1:51:42 – 1:51:42] Adam: All right.
[1:51:43 – 1:51:43] Adam: Thanks for tuning in.
[1:51:44 – 1:51:44] Adam: See you guys.
[1:51:44 – 1:51:45] Adam: Arrivederci for real.